News Hounds

Newsflash: Christ did not die in order for companies to beconme profitable.

Posted by: katsiskats at November 29, 2005 02:59 AM

Sorry for the typo.

I was so outraged I had trouble typing.

Posted by: k at November 29, 2005 03:01 AM

"Every company in America should be on its knees thanking Jesus for being born. Without Christmas, most American businesses would be far less profitable."

OMFG. I nearly choked on my coffee. Can I sue o'reilly for this?

Over on the off topic arena, goob (remember him?) is posting that the big spend at christmas is all thanks to Bush.
Bush = Jesus ?

Has bush any carpentry experience?

Sooooo the bastion of support for keeping december 25th christian, wants to PRRAAAAAZZZZE JEEZUS for allowing himself to be used, free of charge, in this years spendathon! Maybe visa, american express and mastercard will start printing the authentic face of jesus on their cards? Quid Pro Quo.

Nice one billy, proud of ya.

Posted by: uk_dave at November 29, 2005 03:04 AM

Allow me to put my loofah away and type this message. I'm no Christian, but something tells me celebrating the birth of Jesus Christ is, in spirit at least, unrelated to capitalist profits. Or did Jesus come to life with the agenda of being the driving economic force behind the first superpower of the 21st century? Maybe a theologian can answer that for me? The only rational conclusion I can draw from Billy's inane, senseless statements is that he sells more tear-away calendars in December than any other month. Jesus being responsible for commercial sales at Christmas-time is the equivalent of Bush being responsible for ridding Iraq of terrorism. The capitalistic commercialization of winter holidays and gift-giving is good for market-based business. So is charging $4.95 to anyone who wants to send you a personal e-mail. Billy, I'm waiting for you to get down on your knees and thank Jesus for your 4th quarter income.

Shane

Posted by: Shane at November 29, 2005 03:07 AM

One of these days we are going to find out that
Mary was a whore and lied to Joseph so he wouldn't kill her. I can see it now, "No Joseph...it's God's
baby..I swear...no really...I never slept with Jimmy the stone mason!".

Posted by: jeff "with republicans like these, who needs enemies?" valcarcel at November 29, 2005 03:09 AM

UK Dave,
If Bush had carpentry experience, I might think him worth at least a job as a day laborer. Since he hasn't any, I will continue to see him as a spoiled rich kid/ex substance abuser/combat dodger/liar/bully/neo-con tool. Quid Pro Quo, indeed, brother.

Shane

Posted by: Shane at November 29, 2005 03:11 AM

"No Joseph...it's God's
baby..I swear...no really...I never slept with Jimmy the stone mason!".

Posted by: jeff "with republicans like these, who needs enemies?" valcarcel at November 29, 2005 03:09 AM

hmmmmm and then three men turn up... with gifts? Guilty conciences? Child support? Not sure which was the father?

The plot thickens.

(I have my suspicions about the shepherd as well, but for other reasons)

Posted by: uk_dave at November 29, 2005 03:16 AM

UK Dave,
Only Maury Povich can solve this one, and it may still take three episodes. I know enough to know that the more outrageous the "miracle" the uglier the truth likely is. My vote goes to the ugliest and darkest-skinned wise man, as he most likely was the most well-endowed. You won't find that in the Bible though! Too bad they only had those worthless sheepskin condoms back then, otherwise this whole mess could have been avoided. :)

Cheers!
Shane

Posted by: Shane at November 29, 2005 03:20 AM

Um, since when is MSNBC liberal? Not from what I've seen. In fact, you all know this, all the main tv networks are echo chambers of the right wing radicals, like O Reilly. I have to wonder what their coverage of the Torino Olympic Games will be like(the same as its always been on US tv, U.S. athletes good, athletes from other countries "the evil ones".)
I'm Catholic, but I don't recall reading about how Jesus ordered the torture and killing of those who disagreed with Him, or Him siding with the rich and arrogant. These right wing radicals have everything they want: the executive branch, the Senate, the House of "Representatives", the Supreme Court, not to mention the mainstream media, and STILL they cry and whine "liberal bias" when something doesn't go their way, when they damn well know no such thing exists. I mean cry me a river, there are billions of people who are going through unspeakable horror and impoverishment, and these ultra right wing lugnuts claim to be "suffering?"

Posted by: Mike at November 29, 2005 03:35 AM

I wonder if Mr. O'Reilly considers sexual harassment one of those traditions being marginalized by the left?

Next on the No Spin Zone: The Secular Forces vs. Jesus

Posted by: Tom at November 29, 2005 04:37 AM

MSNBC is on O'Reilly's list for one reason: Keith Olbermann.

Posted by: berberry at November 29, 2005 04:39 AM

He really is a petty little child.

Posted by: Shane2 at November 29, 2005 05:21 AM

Has bush any carpentry experience?
Posted by: uk_dave at November 29, 2005 03:04 AM
__
Absolutely!
I saw him on TV with a hammer in his hand after Katrina.
Way after!!!

Posted by: bronxboy at November 29, 2005 06:17 AM

"Every company in America should be on its knees thanking Jesus for being born."

Riiiiiight. I think American companies are still too busy kneeling before Bush and thanking him for those tax cuts. So now Christmas is an economic issue as well? You need to take more Zoloft, Bill....and throw in some Xanax as well. Ahh, fuck it. Nurse, we need some Thorazine, stat! Curious, according to wikipedia, thorazine can be administered rectally....

Posted by: TB at November 29, 2005 06:58 AM

"Every company in America should be on its knees thanking Jesus for being born."

Riiiiiight. I think American companies are still too busy kneeling before Bush and thanking him for those tax cuts. So now Christmas is an economic issue as well? You need to take more Zoloft, Bill....and throw in some Xanax as well. Ahh, fuck it. Nurse, we need some Thorazine, stat! Curious, according to wikipedia, thorazine can be administered rectally....

Posted by: TB at November 29, 2005 06:59 AM

Minitrue would tear Jesus down if he existed today as described in the bible.

Posted by: il128 at November 29, 2005 07:04 AM

My letter to Bill: (My apologies -- I thought sarcasm would work better than trying to appeal to whatever common sense might lurk within him)

To: oreilly@foxnews.com
Sent: Tuesday, November 29, 2005 4:21 AM
Subject: I agree with you 150% - re: Businesses should kneel & thank Jesus for Christmas profits

Without Christmas and Jesus here in the U.S., we'd be another 3rd world country that has nothing but poverty and a plastic Virgin Mary on every dash board.

When you celebrate the Jesus' birthday here in the U.S., you do it in style - with expensive toys, jewelry, and sparkly trees.

In a 3rd world country, you've got nothing but a whole day spent inside a church, cheapo gifts, no shopping days, no one to buy gifts for.

Afterall - the three wise men didn't bring Jesus cheap Christmas cards and Sees Candies -- they brought him rich gifts and that's what makes big-ticket Christmas sales so thankful!

Thanks, Bill, for making me glad I live here.

Ginger
Orange County, CA

Posted by: Ginger Winchester at November 29, 2005 07:28 AM

Talk about abuse of religion.
Truly if there was a god, what better sign could could there be, than a big thunderbolt vaporizing O'Reilly, leaving nothing but a pair of smoking loafers.

Posted by: Office Ed at November 29, 2005 07:30 AM

You all are so LUCKY I'm not Jesus..because if I was God I'd strike you dead and sign my name to it!!!

Some of your comments are so vile and offensive to Christians is it any wonder Bill and the majority of "true" Americans find ourselves dealing with yet another of your attacks against this country.

Get the Hell out already!!!!

Posted by: D. LaCour at November 29, 2005 07:39 AM

You all are so LUCKY I'm not Jesus.....because if I was God I'd strike you dead and sign my name to it!!!

Some of your comments are so vile and offensive to Christians is it any wonder Bill and the majority of "true" Americans find ourselves dealing with yet another of your attacks against this country.

Get the Hell out already!!!

Posted by: D. LaCour at November 29, 2005 07:41 AM

"behind the secular curtain"

WTF is he talking about??
does anyone know what a secular curtain is?
and more importantly, where I can buy one?

Posted by: Office Ed at November 29, 2005 07:49 AM

Didn't Asscroft use the Secular Curtain to drape over a certain statue?

Posted by: double speak at November 29, 2005 07:52 AM

D. Lacour,
if you were Jesus, you would'nt be threatening people with death.
So take your moronic hate based indignation and fuck off.

Posted by: Office Ed at November 29, 2005 07:53 AM

"Every company in America should be on its knees thanking Jesus for being born. Without Christmas, most American businesses would be far less profitable…” This statement misses the whole idea surrounding the celebration of Christmas. From Bill’s twisted point of view Christmas is about commercialism and not the birth of Jesus. As far as his “defamation” media operations one would have to add FOX to the list to make it complete.

Posted by: BillMNJ at November 29, 2005 07:57 AM

bill must be a pagan. Its not the Christian God that listens to corporations.

Posted by: don at November 29, 2005 08:34 AM

He's lost it, he's really lost it!

Posted by: stew at November 29, 2005 08:36 AM

I guess every Christian should be on their knees thanking Jews like me for being responsible for the crucifixion. Without it, the religion would not exist.

Now see, that is a stupid statement. But it's true, kinda.

Has anyone died for trying to celebrate Christmas in America this year? No.

Is anyone saying Christmas should be banned? No.

Is this the dumbest waste of airtime? Absolutely.

Bill O'Reilly is doing more damage to the millions of Christians who want to celebrate Christmas, and aren't insulted that others have other cultures.

AAR

Posted by: adamannapolis at November 29, 2005 08:37 AM

He's lost it, he's really lost it!

Posted by: stew at November 29, 2005 08:39 AM

D(evil) Lacour-

Death threats in the name of Jesus...pretty sweet of you! Nothing I say can be more offensive to (self-proclaimed) Christians than their lying, thieving, amd war-mongering in the name of peace and prosperity is to me. Christians of the right who simultaneously preach their dogma of peace while judging EVERYONE, forcing their views on EVERYONE, and dropping bombs on places in which their specific brand of dogmatic hypocrisy will never take significant root, disgust me. O'Reilly's endorsement of the commercialization of Christ-exploiting seasonal marketing is in the same vein. Think before you type, or limit your correspondence to the 700 Club mailbag, as you're way out of your league here. John Gibson called, he wants to use both halves of your shared brain for a minute.

Shane

Posted by: Shane at November 29, 2005 08:46 AM

jesus must not have a very good contract or lawyer. his image is being used and he isn't getting any royalties. it seems to me that the son of the god wold be getting paid for all this usa of his image. someone should be sueing anyone that uses his image to promote their products without proper compensation and a licensing agreement. jesus is getting screwed in this deal. bill thinks a simple thank you is enough, he's got an entire flock to feed for christ's sake. oops, i mean his sake.

Posted by: chriswithstix at November 29, 2005 08:53 AM

Bill is simply pointing out that any organization that prints lies(the truth)about him is,by definition, fed by some far-left site. Olbermann called him the worst person in the world, but only twice and he surely didn't think of that on his own.

Posted by: TJM at November 29, 2005 08:58 AM

Ginger Winchester: Watch out. O'Dildo will now send his lawyers afer you for slander or just being someone with a brain.

Actually I find it amazing that your from Orange County and still alive to talk about it. I'm not sure if there is a more conserveitive county in the nation.

Posted by: copyright at November 29, 2005 08:59 AM

If only O'Reilly was being heard by more than 1%(+-) of Americans -- his bogus and silly rantings might have an impact.

Of the 1% listening, most are the faithful who think (O'Reilly thinks?) like him in the first place. The rest tune in just to see the freak show.

I doubt he ever changes one critically thinking mind.

O'Reilly is impotent.

Now relax.

Posted by: Larry at November 29, 2005 08:59 AM

"Every company in America should be on its knees thanking Jesus for being born."

Yeah, right.

They should all get on their knees and than Macy's for a Thanksgiving Parade that also marks the arrival of Santa Claus at their store.

MTL
who is so glad he wasn't under the "fornicating M&Ms" balloon.

Posted by: MikeTheLiberal at November 29, 2005 09:05 AM

I don't care what O'Rotten says. I will not give up my subscription to The St. Petersburg Times. It is one of the best papers in Russia. Now he is trying to start an international incident.

Posted by: jack foster at November 29, 2005 09:14 AM

I have no desire to be "civil" to O'Reilly.

The man is a pervert, liar, and bully.

Posted by: Peter at November 29, 2005 09:23 AM

If Christmas is good because celebrating a major holiday encourages christians to spend money, then obviously we should celebrate all the holidays of all other faiths and cultures so that their followers will spend more money too! If that's O'Reilly's arguement, celebrating Christmas to the exclusion of all the other Happy Holidays should be the worst thing we could do. So have a Happy Hannukah, a Sacred Eid-al-Fitr, a Prosperous Kwanza and a Peaceful Naw-Ruz. And a Gnarly Nativity, of course.

Posted by: Joe at November 29, 2005 09:23 AM

Damn this sight needs a spell checker!

As I recall there was a pagan holiday for celebrating the Winter Solestace ?? (shortest day of the year) on December 21 st.

Gifts were exchanged.

When Empereor Constatine converted to Christainity (around 400AD, he of course owned lots of slaves... thats why the support for slavery in the bible and he murdered thousands of others, a real man of peace who never turned the other cheek), he overlayed the pagan Holiday with Christmas and it was celebrated on December 21st for hundreds of years.

Jesus was actually born in April/Spring.

Easter was also a pagan holiday named for a Goddess which was turned into a Christian holiday.

It aparrantly had something to do with fertility and thus rabbits and eggs are symbols for this holiday.

The pagan religions worshiped on Sunday the first day of the week per the Calendar we still go by. So he moved the sabath (7th day/Saturday per old testament) to Sunday the day of pagan worship. So again even the Christain day of worship is now in conflict with the old testament and is now instead based on the Roman's pagan relgion day of worship. Apparantly the word of God changes with the political climate of the times.

He also is responsible for putting together the new testament and resolving the problem that Christianity was not a mono theism since you had god and the son of god born to a virgin ( Virgin in those days only meant a young woman) which of course is a common theme throughout roman and greek religions, that today we call mythologies. Thats when they invented the idea thats Jesus was not his son, but God's image on earth and that god had 3 forms. This solution was stolen from the 3 faces of the Hindu god. There ere many "books" that could have gone into the Bible (all writen generally more than one hundred years after Jesus' death). There are two versions of Revelations for example. There were 4 BOOKs describing the birth of Jesus with very little in common when it comes to the circumstances of his birth. Please note that Christainity has just like all of the pagan relgions a host of lesser gods such as angels,goulies and even giants that just like the Titans were destroyed because their ego got to big.

Then of course the second biggest Holiday is Halloween another pagan holiday.

So in reality we need to be thanking Roman and Greek pagan relgions for when we celebrate our biggest holidays that Christianity just piggy backed on.

Additionally, people have just so much to spend. What happens is the holidays focus spending on a certain time of year and people hold off buying items until the holiday periods. Holidays dont make money, therefore I doubt if they really increase sells over what would sell anyway over the entire year. One could argue that a more evenly distributed retail business model would be more efficient.

One man's region is another man's mythology.

In fact many of the concepts in the old testament come from these same pagan religions. There was trade between the Creeks and the rest of the world pre dating the Hebrew text , wirtten in about 600 BC. Royal families claimed their right to power all over the early world based on a virgin (the Kings mother) having sex with a god, e.g. the founders of Rome, Romulus and Remus as but one example) Christianity for example supports monarchies as the preferred form of government eventhough there had been democracies hundreds of years earlier. But when you have a religon that is put together by Kings and emperors, what do you expect.

Regards

Posted by: Viper at November 29, 2005 09:33 AM

Thanks to Jesus for making people fiscally irresponsible? If that doesn't sum up today's Republican party, what does? I'm Christian, broke, and disgusted.

Posted by: Alex Thorpe at November 29, 2005 09:40 AM

Minitrue would tear Jesus down if he existed today as described in the bible.

Posted by: il128 at November 29, 2005 07:04 AM
[/q]

It would look something like this:

http://www.wiseass.org/html/content-jesus.html

Posted by: Kim, Pb.D at November 29, 2005 09:41 AM

"Damn this sight needs a spell checker!"

I use a browser with a spell checker myself.

Posted by: Alex Thorpe at November 29, 2005 09:44 AM

OReilly has shocked me. I didnt believe my ears.I sent him my daily EMail asking him to try and be nice over the Christmas season.I try to kill him with kindness. Go Keith!!!

Posted by: kay carlton at November 29, 2005 09:44 AM

Please note that God today would get arrested for getting a 13/14 year old girl pregnant in the first place!

Regards

Posted by: Viper at November 29, 2005 09:48 AM

There's no reasonable explanation for the unchristian behavior of the so-called christian right. I may be a lapsed catholic, but I have a pretty good memory. I remember that it is easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of heaven, yet our christian president gives tax cuts to the wealthy. I remember that Jesus cast the money lenders out of the temple, because it was his father's house and they had made it a den of thieves, yet this christian president and congress passed bankruptcy legislation that essentially legalizes loansharking by large corporations. I remember that Jesus taught to aid the poor, for when you do this for the least of my children you have done it for me, yet the president who admires Jesus cuts food stamps to pay for a war. It's rank hypocrisy and you just can't explain it. All you can do is call it by it's name.

The truth is that the conservative movement and the republican party are the organized form of basic human flaws such as selfishness, anger, hate and greed. They simply dress up in the veneer of christianity to blunt criticism and to make themselves feel superior. Blessed are the meek? All are sinners, and fall short of the glory of god? The full, true teachings of the bible are irrelevant to these people. They would build their movement around the Betty Crocker cookbook if they had to. (Apologies to Betty, glorious be her name.)

The worst of all are the non-entities like Bush. Here is a weakling, a coward, a failure and a drunk. He is so damaged that he needs the superficial identity of "christian" to patch up the gaps in his own fractured soul. Beyond that, the details don't matter to him or his cronies. Jesus is just convenient building material for cobbling together a semblance of a functioning human being and propping it up in the White House.

Posted by: Joe at November 29, 2005 09:49 AM

I am part of the Jewish conspiracy: You see, we killed Jesus, knowing that people would create a holiday that would end up being a retail boom for all of the businesses we own!! Once we made a ton of money, we would take over the world, and wipe the word "Christmas" out of the public discourse!!!

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA~!!!

AAR

Posted by: adamannapolis at November 29, 2005 09:54 AM

I am part of the Jewish conspiracy: You see, we killed Jesus, knowing that people would create a holiday that would end up being a retail boom for all of the businesses we own!! Once we made a ton of money, we would take over the world, and wipe the word "Christmas" out of the public discourse!!!

Posted by: adamannapolis

You had me completely fooled. It must have been your brilliant strategy of being driven from your homeland and persecuted for thousands of years. Then, surprise, you flex your muscles and reclaim a piece of real estate the size of a postabe stamp, thus lulling us into overlooking your sinister agenda. You devious masterminds! I kneel in reverence. Now please up my credit limit so I can spend myself into servitude?

Posted by: Joe at November 29, 2005 10:03 AM

Joe-

Our (The Jews) years of persecution obviously pale in comparison to what America is going through with this War on Christmas.

AAR

Posted by: adamannapolis at November 29, 2005 10:07 AM

Fox's hype regarding an imaginary "War Against Christmas" is simply a way to curry favor with that portion of its audience that refuses to accept the fact that the country has changed since the 1950's. Most of that audience doesn't like Jews, Muslims, immigrants, and, yes, Roman Catholics.

It is a carefully re-crafted echo of the "blood libel" (i.e. Christian children were murdered so that their blood could be used to make matzoh), that was a favorite of 19-th century anti-Semitism.

In this case the message is: "Non-Christians in America are defiling and dishonoring the birth of our Saviour!" It is no accident that Goerge Soros (a Hungarian-born Jew) is ritually attacked as one of the masterminds of the "anti-Christmas war." Not to mention the ACLU in which Jews are - and always have been - heavily represented.

Fox's audience understands the message.

Posted by: Peter at November 29, 2005 10:16 AM

First thing someone says "Happy Holidays" instead of "Merry Christmas", and the next thing you know they will be gassing American Christians in concentration camps.

Posted by: Wes at November 29, 2005 10:16 AM

When you are talking about God and business owners what is wrong is real simple.

Most business owners do not believe what God says namely that a laborer is worthy of his hire.

Bush himself made this point very clear in his speech yesterday on immigration.

Why he thinks he has to mislead people in order to get his policies put in place is a mystery to me yet he did it with the war and now he is doing it with immigration.

He said that there are jobs that American workers will not fill and that the business owners need to have workers who are willing to give an honest days work for an honest days pay.

The problem is not legal American workers not willing to give an honest days work it is American business owners not will to offer an honest days pay.

As a matter of fact why do you think business owners are willing to break the law to get cheap labor? American workers want to uphold the law not break it just so they can make more money.

Business owners think they can break the word of God and make more money then keeping it that is the problem with immigration

There is no solution as long as you have corrupt business owners and politicians more concerned with profit than with doing what is right.

Sometimes doing the right thing is costly it’s not always profitable and that scares conservatives especially conservative Christians who already live in total fear of everything and everyone.

Posted by: Ervin at November 29, 2005 10:21 AM

Hey we Christians have stopped persecuting you Jesus killers now! Of course thats only because of Revelations and we need you to be in control of Isarel to fulfill that prophecy. I cant wait for the plagues, world war and all the deaths when most of the world and those terrible non believers (2/3s of the world) die including you guys just because you dont believe that Jesus is the son of god, but wait, he is not even for Christians since he is just Gods image on earth! I'm so confused! Per the same people pushing creation theory, all the evidence says its comming by 2013! And then Jesus will come back and reign as king of Kings and w/o even an election. So much for democracy! Why bother to spread if its going away soon?

Gee armys from the west and the east doing battle in the old holly land and who is a born again?

Regards

Posted by: Viper at November 29, 2005 10:24 AM

Why don't we just make capitalism a religion?

Also, a small point, but I think he means to say "websites that routinely attack..." instead of "websites which routinely attack..."

Where did you go to journalism school Billy?

Posted by: anti-anti-intellectual at November 29, 2005 10:25 AM

Dear anti-anti:

Can you explain the problem with "that" and "which" in that sentence?

People have tried to explain it to me, but I have never been able to understand it.

Posted by: Peter at November 29, 2005 10:31 AM

Joe, excellent post at November 29, 2005 09:49 AM

Posted by: ihategopigs at November 29, 2005 10:39 AM

Talk about abuse of religion.
Truly if there was a god, what better sign could could there be, than a big thunderbolt vaporizing O'Reilly, leaving nothing but a pair of smoking loafers.
Posted by: Office Ed at November 29, 2005 07:30 AM
______
LOL

Posted by: ihaterwtrolls at November 29, 2005 10:40 AM

I am part of the Jewish conspiracy: You see, we killed Jesus, knowing that people would create a holiday that would end up being a retail boom for all of the businesses we own!!

Posted by: adamannapolis at November 29, 2005 09:54 AM
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Bull. We (the Christians) killed Jesus, when we called for Barabas.

Wait, we were Jews back then.

Oh, shiite; I am so screwed!

BTW, AAR: I want that sack of gold all Jews carry around their neck.

AND I want the other sack, too, not just the one you have to give people who know you have a seck of gold, so you give them the sack with only a little gold.

(Thanks, Eric Cartman, for the vital information.)

MTL

Posted by: MikeTheLiberal at November 29, 2005 10:42 AM

[q]
I am part of the Jewish conspiracy: You see, we killed Jesus, knowing that people would create a holiday that would end up being a retail boom for all of the businesses we own!!

Posted by: adamannapolis at November 29, 2005 09:54 AM

[/q]

I'm a member of the Atheist conspiracy. Wanna join forces?

Posted by: Kim, Pb.D at November 29, 2005 10:44 AM

vaporizing O'Reilly, leaving nothing but a pair of smoking loafers.
Posted by: Office Ed at November 29, 2005 07:30 AM

or smoking loofahs!

clever......

Posted by: uk_dave at November 29, 2005 10:47 AM

Kat wrote:
Newsflash: Christ did not die in order for companies to become profitable.
----------------------------------------------------
No shit. Billy was merely pointing out that most retailers do about 50% of their yearly business during the "CHRISTMAS" season. Without the birth of Jesus there would be no CHRISTMAS.

I hate the idea of agreeing with him, but on this issue I agree with Billy. I feel the same way about using the phrase "Merry Christmas". Celebrating "Cultural Diveristy" has gone way too far in this country.

Posted by: Spartacus at November 29, 2005 10:49 AM

"I'm a member of the Atheist conspiracy. Wanna join forces?"

Posted by: Kim, Pb.D at November 29, 2005 10:44 AM
_________________________________________________

Let's fight side by side as members of the "Secular Progressive" Army that Bill is so afraid of!!

We will soon have control!! No more Charlie Daniels!!

AAR

Posted by: adamannapolis at November 29, 2005 10:51 AM

Spartacus,

Now I'm confused. Is Christmas financial or spiritual?

Posted by: Wes at November 29, 2005 10:51 AM

And don't say both. Christ himself said you cannot serve both masters.

Posted by: Wes at November 29, 2005 10:52 AM

good grief,
Bill was using "hyperbole" to express his point.

Posted by: dreamryder at November 29, 2005 10:52 AM

You know, I can't recall seeing such an exhibition of stupidity as displayed on this thread.

Posted by: dreamryder at November 29, 2005 11:01 AM

good grief,
Bill was using "hyperbole" to express his point.

Posted by: dreamryder at November 29, 2005 10:52 AM
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Oh, good. I was afraid he was making another "sarcastic riff."

MTL

Posted by: MikeTheLiberal at November 29, 2005 11:01 AM

Wes wrote:
Now I'm confused. Is Christmas financial or spiritual?
---------------------------------------------------
It is absolutely "Spiritual", Wes. I was referring to the practices that go along with the holiday. You know...things like Santa Claus, gift giving, etc. I personally believe that Christmas has turned into a celebration of conspicuous consumption. However, I DO have many fond memories of childhood Christmas'.

Again...my ONLY point is that retailers depend on "Christmas" for at least 50% of their yearly business. Perhaps that is a sad statement about us.

Posted by: Spartacus at November 29, 2005 11:01 AM

OK dream,
Just what point was he making, by equating Christmas with corporate profits?

Posted by: Office Ed at November 29, 2005 11:02 AM

When businesses say "Happy Holidays" instead of "Merry Christmas," they are doing so in an effort to include ALL Americans, rather than just Christians. Why would a business want to alienate 15% of the population for no good reason (I have to believe that less than 15% will actually avoid shopping somewhere because they DIDNT say merry Christmas)?

These businesses are trying to maximize profit. Obviously, more people feel included when they say "Happy Holidays."

This is the free market in action. Isn't this supposed to be the basis of the Republican Party?

I guess Republicans only like the free market until it results in something they dont like, then they complain about it like babies.

Posted by: johnny at November 29, 2005 11:04 AM

Perhaps we SHOULD change the way we celebrate Christmas. I hate crowds. Especially at Christmas. People are vicious. Two practices that I have been doing for about 4 years now is that a fellow musician and I visit VA hospitals and perform for the patients. We also go to a local Mentally Handicapped Group Home and lead them all in singing Christmas carols. I get more out of these activities than I do swapping gifts with family members.

Posted by: Spartacus at November 29, 2005 11:07 AM

This here should really get Mr. O’Lielly panties in a bunch... http://www.salon.com/news/feature/2005/11/29/foxman/index_np.html

Posted by: ihaterwtrolls at November 29, 2005 11:08 AM

Falafel Man's Vibratin' Machine must be rattling those 'brains' he sits on . .

"The following media operations have regularly helped distribute defamation and false information supplied by far RIGHT websites:

FOX (duh . . )

Posted by: Liz PbD at November 29, 2005 11:09 AM

Falafel Man's Vibratin' Machine must be rattling those 'brains' he sits on . .

Posted by: Liz PbD at November 29, 2005 11:09 AM

And he has it on the meringue setting...oooooooh

Posted by: uk_dave at November 29, 2005 11:13 AM

johnny wrote:
When businesses say "Happy Holidays" instead of "Merry Christmas," they are doing so in an effort to include ALL Americans, rather than just Christians.
----------------------------------------------------
Please show me someone who's been hospitalized with PTSD for hearing the words "Merry Christmas"! "CHRISTMAS" IS a National Holiday. Perhaps we should do away with Veteran's Day so as not to offend non-Veterans?! We could just say "Thank you for serving on November 11th" every year so we could include everyone who was doing SOMETHING on Nov. 11th. Jeeeeeeeeezzzzzzzzzzzz

Posted by: Spartacus at November 29, 2005 11:14 AM

I think Dr. Seuss's Grinch book was anti-Christian.
I want it taken out of all public libraries. Immediately! The Grinch stole it...HOAX viewers want it back.

Posted by: ihaterwtrolls at November 29, 2005 11:14 AM

"The following media operations have regularly helped distribute defamation and false information supplied by far RIGHT websites:
__
Great catch, Liz. That got right past me.

Posted by: ihaterwtrolls at November 29, 2005 11:16 AM

Anyone been hospitalised with PTSD for hearing "happy holidays"?

Who has the right to dictate to shop owners and managers how they instruct their staff to greet customers or display seasonal gifts?

No one is picketing a store for having 'happy christmas' in the window, but bill o'reilly is incensed when they don't have it.

It is a non story, if only he'd leave the damn thing alone.

But it's fun to watch...from a distance.

Posted by: uk_dave at November 29, 2005 11:19 AM

I guess the REAL meaning of Christmas is commercialism and unbridled materialism. Thank Jesus for greed and consumerism!

O'Reilly needs to realize that the Christmas we now celebrate was CREATED by businesses. They are the ones pushing the shopping season...not religion of Jesus. Just like how businesses created "black friday", "Boxing day", "Valentine's day", "mothers day", "fathers day", etc. They may notn have created the actual DAY, but they certainly created the commerical attitudes of "must spend money and buy stuff" that now surround every single day.

Thank Jesus? Please. They use Jesus for their own greedy needs almost as much as O'Reilly himself.

Posted by: Rosencrantz at November 29, 2005 11:19 AM

It is a non story, if only he'd leave the damn thing alone.
Posted by: uk_dave at November 29, 2005 11:19 AM
__
That's it precisely! I grew up in a very large city where Merry Christmas was said along with Happy Chanukah. No one gave a shit. I wasn't traumatized. He and Gibson need to find another horse to beat. This one's dead.

Posted by: ihaterwtrolls at November 29, 2005 11:23 AM

Rosencrantz
What is boxing day?
Don't tell me that draft dodger got a day named after him...

Posted by: ihaterwtrolls at November 29, 2005 11:25 AM

After the exhibition displayed here, I printed it out, all 18 pages.
I 'm pleased as punch that I didn't use my given name as I would be supremely embarrassed to be associated with this group.
The icing on the cake, that after I brought your ERROR to your attention you continued.
What conclusion can be gleaned from this? That you're idiots!

Posted by: dreamryder at November 29, 2005 11:28 AM

As another member of the *EVIL ATHEIST CONSPIRACY* (tm), I rarely find common cause with my Christian brothers & sisters.

But I'll stand shoulder-to-shoulder with (some of) them on this one: [url]http://www.buynothingchristmas.org/
[/url]

I've informed everyone in my circle that I don't observe Christmas and won't be giving or receiving any gifts.

I can almost hear the rejoinder: "what about giving gifts/charity to the less fortunate??" My answer: that ought to be a year-round activity.

BUY NOTHING!

evil atheist mondojohnson

Posted by: mondojohnson at November 29, 2005 11:30 AM

"I 'm pleased as punch...."

Posted by: dreamryder at November 29, 2005 11:28 AM

If only you was as good looking as punch.

Posted by: uk_dave at November 29, 2005 11:33 AM

ihatewrtrolls: Boxing Day is December 26th. It's a holiday in Canada (maybe elsewhere).

I think it has something to do with getting rid of all the boxes you got during Christmas. I'm hoping one of the neighbors to the north can provide more information.

MTL

Posted by: MikeTheLiberal at November 29, 2005 11:35 AM

"evil atheist mondojohnson"
---------------------------------------------------
The greatest minds throughout history up to and including Stephen Hawking believe in a "Creator"....man are you in for a shock when you punch out, mondo!

Posted by: Spartacus at November 29, 2005 11:36 AM

Falafel Man personifies 'disingenuous' doesn't he . .
-------------------------------------------------
Richard Mellon Scaife, the most generous donor to conservative causes in American history, is astoundingly rich and has given away more than $600 million, yet is known to people who have worked for him as a cheapskate.

He has given at least $340 million to fund a "war of ideas" against American liberalism, yet no one interviewed for these articles could remember him discussing a book he had read or recall an original idea that came from him.

http://www.tylwythteg.com/enemies/scaife.html

Posted by: Liz PbD at November 29, 2005 11:36 AM

After the exhibition displayed here, I printed it out, all 18 pages.
I 'm pleased as punch that I didn't use my given name as I would be supremely embarrassed to be associated with this group.
The icing on the cake, that after I brought your ERROR to your attention you continued.
What conclusion can be gleaned from this? That you're idiots!

Posted by: dreamryder at November 29, 2005 11:28 AM
_________________________________________________

Now is not the time for name calling. There is a War on Christmas going on, and we will never win if we resort to the name calling that the "Happy Holidays" crowd a/k/a the secular progressive Bush haters resort to.

We must stay on message, or the colors red and green will be no more...We must stand by O'Reilly and Gibson, and we will never lose, Dreamryder!

We all realize that Katrina, Iraq, Plamegate, etc..are minor issues in the big picture. We ned to fight for our right to have the reindeer displayed at every mall in America!!!

Hooray~!!

AAR

Posted by: adamannapolis at November 29, 2005 11:39 AM

Boxing Day is December 26th. It's a holiday in Canada (maybe elsewhere).
----------------------------------------------------
It originated in Great Britian. :-)

Posted by: Spartacus at November 29, 2005 11:42 AM

posted by dream: "I 'm pleased as punch"

as opposed to the 98% of newshound contributors, who would be pleased if you were punched.

still waiting for an answer to my question Dream, exactly what point was Oreilly making?

Posted by: Office Ed at November 29, 2005 11:42 AM

Again....I think we need to do away with Memorial Day and Veteran's Day so that we don't offend those who did not serve in the Military or die in the service of their country. We certainly don't want to "offend" ANYONE!

Posted by: Spartacus at November 29, 2005 11:45 AM

Dr. Pete and I have been celebrating Boxing Day with our British friends for years.

It was traditionally a day for charity (the servants would have to work Xmas, so the next day was when they'd celebrate, the employers would traditionally box up their leftovers and give it to the servants).

So what we usually do is pack up some canned goods and clothes and drop them off at the Lutheran church on the way to the pub. Then get drunk at the pub. It's nice.

I used to go to a different British Pub, before it closed, that had an AMAZING boxing day party. Hilariously, it was the only service I'd attend all year as they had a holiday mass at the bar before the party started. If you brought in canned good or clothes, you'd get a ticket for a free pint. They served bangers & mash all day long. It was awesome.

My purse got stolen from the same party one year. Some jerk helped himeslf to my charity! To make up for it, I got to drink for free all day!

Another year, a really drunk guy threw up in the box of Christmas Crackers. That was awesome.

Good time, good times.

Posted by: Kim, Pb.D at November 29, 2005 11:45 AM

Boxing Day is December 26th. It's a holiday in Canada (maybe elsewhere).
----------------------------------------------------
It originated in Great Britian. :-)

Posted by: Spartacus at November 29, 2005 11:42 AM
_
What's it about? Can O'Lielly start a rant? You know how he hates those Europeans.

Posted by: ihaterwtrolls at November 29, 2005 11:48 AM

Thanks for the info Kim...
Cheers!

Posted by: ihaterwtrolls at November 29, 2005 11:49 AM

[q]
Again....I think we need to do away with Memorial Day and Veteran's Day so that we don't offend those who did not serve in the Military or die in the service of their country. We certainly don't want to "offend" ANYONE!

[/q]

There's a difference between doing something to be kind and inclusive, and doing something so as not to offend.

I've always said Happy Holidays. Being inclusive and open, as opposed to mean, is very much in the Christmas Spirit, wouldn't you agree?

I say Merry Christmas at Christmas parties, on Christmas and Christmas eve, and that's about it. Big deal.

As far as you all commenting on the materialism, I always find myself in a quandry. I oppose the materialism, but I love getting presents. Go figure.

Posted by: Kim, Pb.D at November 29, 2005 11:50 AM

Kim,
You will be pleased to know that the UK licensing laws have just changed this week, and pubs can stay open 24 hours.
Christmas Eve is also an great night out in a pub, everybody is really chilled, and there's hardly any drunken brawling, we save that for new years eve (now thats a bloodbath, like something out of saving private ryan)

Posted by: Office Ed at November 29, 2005 11:52 AM

Spartacus, and you know about this surprise How? Please, I'd like to meet the person who has checked out reconned the other side and come back to report to you.Either one of the options are just more of the religious BS they feel they have to peddle to keep believers in line.Said believers being CHRISTians who seem to have forgotten CHRIST's admonition about how other people ought to be treated.

Posted by: donquixote'shorse at November 29, 2005 11:57 AM

Kim wrote:
I oppose the materialism, but I love getting presents. Go figure.
---------------------------------------------------
It's never as good as when we were kids. I think that is one of the reasons so many people get the holiday blues. What I wanted as a kid is very different from today. In my letter to Santa this year I asked for a 44'Morgan Out Island Ketch, a Porche 911 Targa, and a new home on the island of Barbados. My tastes have changed since I wanted a BB gun as a boy. I sure hope Santa thinks I've been a good boy this year....LOL ;-)

Posted by: Spartacus at November 29, 2005 11:59 AM

Ed,

The same pub that had the Boxing Day party also had a fantastic Christmas Eve party. It was really chill. Loved it.

Dr. Pete and I are constantly talking about flying to London for one of these holiday seasons to celebrate Christmas over there. We tend to celebrate a very English version of the holiday as it is. Of course, Charles Dickens didn't so much invent the emerging modern version of Christmas, but he did do wonders to popularize it.

Posted by: Kim, Pb.D at November 29, 2005 11:59 AM

Office Ed wrote:
You will be pleased to know that the UK licensing laws have just changed this week, and pubs can stay open 24 hours.
----------------------------------------------------
Damn! I wish they'd done this back when I was drinking. I loved hitting the pubs in London! How many people here have ever tasted "Spotted Dick"? Trust me....but I will let our UK posters explain...LOL

Posted by: Spartacus at November 29, 2005 12:02 PM

Has bush any carpentry experience?
Posted by: uk_dave at November 29, 2005 03:04 AM
__
Absolutely!
I saw him on TV with a hammer in his hand after Katrina.
Way after!!!

Posted by: bronxboy at November 29, 2005 06:17 AM

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Actually dave if you saw the videos you know they prove that the chimperor may only have seen a hammer for the first time that day. If he'd have been choked up on the handle any more he'd have been gripping the thing by the claws. I kept waiting for him to waste his thumb, but no such luck.

Posted by: donquixote'shorse at November 29, 2005 12:04 PM

In 2000 76.5% of the US population was Christian. We believe that Christ is the son of god, our saviour. The attacks on Christ, on this website, serve no interest but to hurt us and demean that which we hold sacred. Thank you for you understanding and complete disregard for our beliefs. We will remember when we cast 76% of the vote.

Posted by: bill at November 29, 2005 12:04 PM

Spartacus: Hawking is at best ambiguous on the matter, employing the same sort of loose, scientific pantheism as Einstein and Carl Sagan (i.e. "God is the sum total of all natural phenomena")...

Your argument about "all the great minds throughout history have believed in creator" is very easily refuted: [url]http://www.wonderfulatheistsofcfl.org/Quotes.htm[/url], for instance.

What is this post-mortem "shock" I'm in for, and what's your evidence for it?

:)

Happy Festivus
mondojohnson

Posted by: mondojohnson at November 29, 2005 12:04 PM

donquixote's horse wrote:
Spartacus, and you know about this surprise How?
-----------------------------------------------------
Let me just refer you to Stephen Hawking. When asked what God was doing before he/she created the Universe, Hawking replied,"Creating hell for people who ask such questions".

btw...never met an athiest during a fire-fight.

Posted by: Spartacus at November 29, 2005 12:07 PM

btw...never met an athiest during a fire-fight.

Posted by: Spartacus at November 29, 2005 12:07 PM
__
Or in a fox hole

Posted by: ihaterwtrolls at November 29, 2005 12:12 PM

Actually I'm sure if God exists he would not approve of a person suddenly transforming into a believer during a fire-fight. It's the same line of think as "I will believe just in case it might be true.".....Not very deep, or impressive beliefs I'd say.

Posted by: Wes at November 29, 2005 12:12 PM

Let's fight side by side as members of the "Secular Progressive" Army that Bill is so afraid of!!

We will soon have control!! No more Charlie Daniels!!

AAR

Posted by: adamannapolis at November 29, 2005 10:51 AM
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
And I'll be pleased to join you both as long as that is for sure no more charlie daniels and not Jack.

Posted by: donquixote'shorse at November 29, 2005 12:12 PM

http://www.atheistfoxholes.org/

Posted by: mondojohnson at November 29, 2005 12:13 PM

To Mondo:
--------------------------------------------------
I have no intention of debating the existence of a Creator with you. My belief is based on faith and the mathematical odds against everything "just happening". Just as you must accept your athiesim on faith since you have no proof otherwise.

Posted by: Spartacus at November 29, 2005 12:13 PM

"Please show me someone who's been hospitalized with PTSD for hearing the words "Merry Christmas"! "

------------------------------------

They are in the same hospital room as the person who collapsed because someone said "Happy Holidays" to them!

------------------------------------

"The attacks on Christ, on this website, serve no interest..."

------------------------------------

I've double checked, and I see no attacks on Christ here. Or do you see the term "Happy Holidays" (which is used as a catch-all for the holiday season from Thanksgiving through New Years) as an attack? If you do, you'd better take a long, hard look at your spirituality. It is seriously lacking substance, if you buy into this "War On Christmas" nonsense.

Posted by: Stosh at November 29, 2005 12:13 PM

Bill,
the only problem with your post is that CHRISTIANITY IS NOT BEING ATTACKED.
90% of these posts have not attacked your religion in any way.
These posts are from people who are unhappy with O'Reillys comments, comments that should be offensive to REAL CHRISTIANS.
What is wrong with you people, why are you always whinging?

Posted by: Office Ed at November 29, 2005 12:15 PM

Wes wrote:
Not very deep, or impressive beliefs I'd say.
----------------------------------------------------
I guess it's sort of "you had to be there" kind of things when you are covered with one guy's brains splattered on your uniform, holding another guy's intestines in place as he gasps his last breath crying out for two things...his mother and God.

Posted by: Spartacus at November 29, 2005 12:18 PM

They are in the same hospital room as the person who collapsed because someone said "Happy Holidays" to them!= Non argument...just a "trendy" statement.

Posted by: Spartacus at November 29, 2005 12:21 PM

I wanna hear more about that 'spotted dick' . .

Posted by: Liz PbD at November 29, 2005 12:22 PM

I think Billy is more interested in selling Factor Gear for holiday presents than anything else. That and his book. He keeps bragging about being number four on the NY Times best-seller list. He doesn't say that he's number four in the category "Paper Back Advice" behind Why Do Men Have Nipples? By the way, is this the only section of the NY Times that has any credibility?

Posted by: John at November 29, 2005 12:22 PM

Spartacus , then you were in the wrong ones. I agree with an ex-jarhead friend of mine Khe Sanh time veteran says there's nothing but atheists in foxholes as no rational thinking being would believe in a deity who'd put them in that situation, course the stipulations rational and thinking might exclude you.And you didn't answer the question about who'd reconned the other side and reported back.

Posted by: donquixote'shorse at November 29, 2005 12:25 PM

Go watch the video talking point, this is Bill being himself. There was no hint of extravagant exaggeration in the video; he meant every word just as he spoke it. His plea to reclaim our heritage (whatever that means) was as sincere as the rest of the "point".
Poor dreamryder, it goes to all that trouble to look up another polysyllabic word then misapprehends its context.

Posted by: TJM at November 29, 2005 12:26 PM

Liz wrote:
I wanna hear more about that 'spotted dick'
---------------------------------------------------
It is an absolutely delicious desert served in London Pubs, Liz. Don't ask me where the name came from...I had to bring back menus from one of my trips just to prove to friends that I was telling the truth....:-)

Posted by: Spartacus at November 29, 2005 12:29 PM

Spartacus,

You mean you can go to heaven just by crying out "God" at the end? Then what's the point of believing or calling before then?

Posted by: Wes at November 29, 2005 12:29 PM

horse wrote:
there's nothing but atheists in foxholes as no rational thinking being would believe in a deity who'd put them in that situation
----------------------------------------------------
A "deity" never put them there. Men put them there. And, AGAIN, I have no intention of debating an "afterlife". Just as I accept on faith there is one, you accept on faith that there isn't one.

Posted by: Spartacus at November 29, 2005 12:33 PM

Wes wrote:
You mean you can go to heaven just by crying out "God" at the end?
---------------------------------------------------
YOUR words, not mine. I never said the above. I simply reported on personal experiences from serving three tours in Vietnam.

Posted by: Spartacus at November 29, 2005 12:35 PM

I guess O'Reilly would consider me against Christmas because I am against the commercialization of it. I don't buy gifts for anyone. It goes completely against the teachings of Christ, it propagates greed, and it adds to material glut. As Amercians, in our culture, we are never satisfied with what we have and are always seeking bigger, better, new and improved. That's because the so-called satisfaction of owning more and more things is hollow and can never be filled. So we've morphed a holy and sacred rememberance of Christ, who's teachings are the opposite of how we celebrate His holy day, into a commercial buying frenzy. We buy things we don't even need, or because they're better than our older models. This is the true war on Christmas! The best way to honor Christ is to be a good Christian every day of the year. Giving of self, caring for those less fortunate, donating to food banks, buying winter coats for poor children (and their parents), giving a ride to the grocery store to the elderly lady next door are all part of what Jesus wants us to do at all times. No one ever feels slighted by me during this holiday, because they know my giving knows no bounds and is not restricted to one day a year. I purposely boycot any and all unneccessary spending at this time of year because I do not want to participate in the greed glut of retailers and corporations. They've found a way to capitalize on the fake Christians, and I happen to be a real one. Yes, there is a war on Christmas, but it's got nothing to do with saying "Merry Christmas" vs "Happy Holidays".
Peace on Earth
Good Will to Men

Posted by: Jonette at November 29, 2005 12:35 PM

Jesus, please protect me from your followers. ?!?!

Posted by: EtJ at November 29, 2005 12:36 PM

Spartacus,

I beg your pardon, but it was YOU who introduced the subject of fire-fights and God.

Posted by: Wes at November 29, 2005 12:37 PM

"No proof" is the cornerstone of atheism. It should be the default position of all enlightened people.

To trot out the old argument: I can't prove that there's NOT an invisible flying spaghetti monster orbiting (FSM) my head. Should I therefore be "agnostic" on the subject, or have to tiptoe politely around those who believe in the FSM? No. The burden of proof is on the FSM believer to convince me.

My position is not based on "faith" of any kind. It is based a preponderance of empirical evidence (occasionally clouded by my increasingly faulty senses).

No personal animosity is intended, Spartacus... and I apologize to everyone for going a bit O/T. But in these hyper-religious days I feel more compelled to speak up for secularism.

"Deeds not prayers...."

Posted by: mondojohnson at November 29, 2005 12:38 PM

Posted by: Spartacus,

"Let me just refer you to Stephen Hawking. When asked what God was doing before he/she created the Universe, Hawking replied,"Creating hell for people who ask such questions".

I'm going to grant you the benefit of the doubt and assume you weren't deliberately misquoting but simply didn't understand Hawking's book when you (of course) read it for yourself. Full text below.

"As we shall see, the concept of time has no meaning before the beginning of the universe. This was first pointed out by St. Augustine. When asked: What did God do before he created the universe? Augustine didn't reply: He was preparing Hell for people who asked such questions. Instead, he said that time was a property of the universe that God created, and that time did not exist before the beginning of the universe. (Stephen Hawking, A Brief History of Time)

Posted by: Robrob at November 29, 2005 12:38 PM

From the Straight Dope:

The earliest recipes for spotted dick are from 1847. For non-British readers, "spotted dick" is a boiled suet pudding, with bits of dried fruit (usually raisins or currants) that (as already noted) look like little spots.

The Oxford Companion to Food comments that, strictly speaking, "spotted dick" is made by taking a flat sheet, spreading sugar and raisins on it, then rolling it up. A similar dessert is "spotted dog," a plain cylinder of suet paste with the raisins and currants and sugar stuck into it, so that the spots are visible on the outside. Both spotted dick and spotted dog were traditionally boiled (or even steamed) in a cloth, but nowadays they are usually baked.

http://www.straightdope.com/mailbag/mspotteddick.html

now I'm hungry!
ufo

Posted by: ufoshadow at November 29, 2005 12:39 PM

When CBS aired the Bush National Guard story, who led the charge to smear the entire network as a disgrace? Fox.

When Newsweek was accused of fomenting riots in Afghanistan, who led the attacks on Newsweek's "patriotism"? Fox and the moonie Washington Times.

Who regularly attacks the Washington Post, the New York times for their stances and failings?

Eventually, instead of rolling over to these attacks with apologies and firings, these news organizations are going to notice that their corporate competitor (Fox) is laughing all the way to the market share by trumping up these "scandals". Its not about "red/blue" as much as basic business competition. Naturally this is why MSNBC makes O'Reilly's list, as the clearest competitor shaping out of the mainstream media to Fox's future economic growth.

Posted by: Quatrain Gleam at November 29, 2005 12:42 PM

The secular Left wants to rid the West of Judeo-Christian values, which is why the Left doesn't condemn Radical Islam, because that would put the Left on the same side as those with Judeo-Christian values.

Posted by: Jose Chung at November 29, 2005 12:43 PM

Spartacus,

You fight fire? How do you do it? Do you put boxing gloves on the flames and challenge them to 12 rounds or simply shove up against them in a bar and hope for a scuffle to break out?

I know.......bad jokes.....I've got'em!

I'd just like to point out that throughout my 13 years of military service I have remained an atheist. Go to the Atheists in Foxholes website to meet more of the same.
http://www.atheistfoxholes.org/

I've always wondered- Do people actually stop during a "fire-fight" or similar dangerous activity and question the religious convictions of the man/woman next to them to determine whether or not there are any atheists about? These are the things I think of late at night while eating cold tacos leftover from dinner.

Posted by: James at November 29, 2005 12:45 PM

"They are in the same hospital room as the person who collapsed because someone said "Happy Holidays" to them!= Non argument...just a "trendy" statement."

-----------------------------------------

Yes, just as the statement "Please show me someone who's been hospitalized with PTSD for hearing the words "Merry Christmas"!" was a non-argument! Gee - you finally get it!

(Somehow I doubt if he really gets it. Instead, he will, sheeplike, continue to rant and rave against the non-existant "War On Christmas", which never existed until Fox told him it did! After all, retailers can distort the meaning of Christmas by making it all about greed and consumerism, but as long as they say "Merry Christmas" as they ring up your purchases, all is well with the world.)

Posted by: Stosh at November 29, 2005 12:49 PM

Mondo wrote:
"Deeds not prayers...."
---------------------------------------------------
Hmmmmmmmmm...this is exactly what Jesus taught.

Posted by: Spartacus at November 29, 2005 12:51 PM

Bill,
the only problem with your post is that CHRISTIANITY IS NOT BEING ATTACKED.
90% of these posts have not attacked your religion in any way.
These posts are from people who are unhappy with O'Reillys comments, comments that should be offensive to REAL CHRISTIANS.
What is wrong with you people, why are you always whinging?

Posted by: Office Ed at November 29, 2005 12:15 PM

I find the following posts offensive... It amazes me how now i'm one of YOU people. Exactly what is one of YOU PEOPLE Ed? I'm not whining, i'm simply stating fact. You folks here see the offensive stuff and make no comment. It's as if it was never said. You just accept it. Well it is very offensive. You are offended by one person's statements yet state in your post that i shouldn't let 10% bother me. I have a good memory Ed. Many Christians do. We believe in Christ and hold those beliefs dear. When you don't acknowledge someone taking a crap on what we hold dear, you stand with them. Give me a reason to vote with someone who would do that Ed.

One of these days we are going to find out that
Mary was a whore and lied to Joseph so he wouldn't kill her. I can see it now, "No Joseph...it's God's
baby..I swear...no really...I never slept with Jimmy the stone mason!".

Posted by: jeff "with republicans like these, who needs enemies?" valcarcel at November 29, 2005 03:09 AM

"No Joseph...it's God's
baby..I swear...no really...I never slept with Jimmy the stone mason!".

Posted by: jeff "with republicans like these, who needs enemies?" valcarcel at November 29, 2005 03:09 AM

hmmmmm and then three men turn up... with gifts? Guilty conciences? Child support? Not sure which was the father?

The plot thickens.

(I have my suspicions about the shepherd as well, but for other reasons)

Posted by: uk_dave at November 29, 2005 03:16 AM

UK Dave,
Only Maury Povich can solve this one, and it may still take three episodes. I know enough to know that the more outrageous the "miracle" the uglier the truth likely is. My vote goes to the ugliest and darkest-skinned wise man, as he most likely was the most well-endowed. You won't find that in the Bible though! Too bad they only had those worthless sheepskin condoms back then, otherwise this whole mess could have been avoided. :)

Cheers!
Shane

Posted by: Shane at November 29, 2005 03:20 AM

Please note that God today would get arrested for getting a 13/14 year old girl pregnant in the first place!

Regards

Posted by: Viper at November 29, 2005 09:48 AM

Posted by: bill at November 29, 2005 12:51 PM

We all realize that Katrina, Iraq, Plamegate, etc..are minor issues in the big picture.

Posted by: adamannapolis

I think the implication here is pretty obvious, so I will come out and admit it. Jesus is a covert CIA operative. He used his influence to have his close friend Santa Claus sent to the north pole to investigate claims regarding TMDs (Toy of Merry Delight). I would have revealed this earlier but I did not want to be subpoenaed to appear before the reindeer, as I had important laundry to wash.

Remember, the issue is not whether Santa has been violating his responsibilities as a jolly old elf to pursue a partisan agenda. The issue is who violated Christmas security by disclosing this information. Oh, that was me. Crap.

Happy Saturnalia, and to all a good fight.

Posted by: Joe at November 29, 2005 12:52 PM

The secular Left wants to rid the West of Judeo-Christian values, which is why the Left doesn't condemn Radical Islam, because that would put the Left on the same side as those with Judeo-Christian values.

Posted by: Jose Chung at November 29, 2005 12:43 PM

I condemn radical islam
I condemn radical christianity
God/allah does not exist
Jose is misguided, possibly by the hand of the devil, who also doesn't exist...and neither does jose.

Happy now?

Posted by: uk_dave at November 29, 2005 12:52 PM

Now, can we hear some condemnation on this thread from jose chung regarding the christian attacks on the secular traditions of your country?

Posted by: uk_dave at November 29, 2005 12:53 PM

James wrote:
I've always wondered- Do people actually stop during a "fire-fight" or similar dangerous activity and question the religious convictions of the man/woman next to them...
--------------------------------------------------
No. All you're doing is trying to keep each other alive. :-)

Posted by: Spartacus at November 29, 2005 12:53 PM

I wanna hear more about that 'spotted dick' . .

Posted by: Liz PbD at November 29, 2005 12:22 PM
-------------------------------------------------
Hey, Mami... you still the same... :-)

Posted by: Jorge at November 29, 2005 12:55 PM

nice cut and paste there bill, real glad you mastered it..... oh did that offend you?

Posted by: uk_dave at November 29, 2005 12:55 PM

Jose, I recommend "The End of Faith" by Sam Harris, as well as the post-9/11 essay of Richard Dawkins in "A Devil's Chaplain." In those works you'll find that Islam is given the same shellacking as other forms of magical thinking.

The "secular left", in so far as I can presume to speak for it, decries injection of *all* religion into civic affairs.

Where have you gone, Thomas Jefferson?

Posted by: mondojohnson at November 29, 2005 12:55 PM

hey bill.... would YOU agree that Hillary Clinton IS the smartest woman in the world?

tee hee

Posted by: uk_dave at November 29, 2005 12:57 PM

ufo wrote:
boiled suet pudding...
------------------------------------------------
could you describe "suet pudding", please? I remember it being sort of a "pudding cake" filled with currants and a delicious vanilla cream sauce on top. I can easily assume there are variations on a theme, but the term "suet" is unfamiliar to me in terms of cooking.

Posted by: Spartacus at November 29, 2005 12:58 PM

Spotted Dick is suet pudding?

Merriam Webster on line defines suet as: "The hard fat about the kidneys and loins in beef and mutton that yields tallow."

Still hungry? This ranks right up there with "drippin' ", another contribution to world cuisine from our cousins across the pond. No offense, UK Dave, but this is an example of why "Gourmet British Cuisine" is an oxymoron.

Posted by: Joe at November 29, 2005 01:01 PM

[q]
The attacks on Christ, on this website, serve no interest but to hurt us and demean that which we hold sacred.
[/q]

What, some one put a gun to your head to force you to come here?

Jesus doesn't like whiners!

BTW: For all of you interested in discussing the broader aspects of Christianity and Atheism, there's two excellent threads over in Off Topic. They're either on the first or second page. I'd prolly be better to discuss those things there.

Posted by: Kim, Pb.D at November 29, 2005 01:01 PM

To the UK posters: is it true that in the UK that government-sanctioned vacation days are shorn of religious titles and simply called "bank holidays"? Or does the state recognize Christmas? Just curious.

(OT: "Bank Holiday" -- great Blur song)

Posted by: mondojohnson at November 29, 2005 01:01 PM

could you describe "suet pudding", please? I remember it being sort of a "pudding cake" filled with currants and a delicious vanilla cream sauce on top. I can easily assume there are variations on a theme, but the term "suet" is unfamiliar to me in terms of cooking.

Posted by: Spartacus at November 29, 2005 12:58 PM

Me too. All I did was google and cut and paste.
There is more info if you follow the link I posted.

Posted by: ufoshadow at November 29, 2005 01:02 PM

mondo....no

http://www.dti.gov.uk/er/bankhol.htm

but we wouldn't care if they were...it's just a tag

Posted by: uk_dave at November 29, 2005 01:05 PM

[q]
I've always wondered- Do people actually stop during a "fire-fight" or similar dangerous activity and question the religious convictions of the man/woman next to them to determine whether or not there are any atheists about?
[/q]

Hah! That reminds me of the scene from Monty Python's Meaning of Life where they throw the birthday party in the foxhole.

Posted by: Kim, Pb.D at November 29, 2005 01:05 PM

Bill-

I respect your religious beliefs, and apologize if you feel offended by anything that I said.

Some people are unable to find humor in religious humor, that I understand.

But surely there is humor (black humor) in the fact that 1 million people were killed in Sudan in a huge Genocide, which warranted little to no airtime on Fox, yet hours and hours and books are spent talking about how assimilation and freedom of religion are ruining the life of the WASP.

AAR

Posted by: adamannapolis at November 29, 2005 01:06 PM

mondo, well actually i take that 'no' back... strictly speaking yes, they are all called 'bank holidays' on that site, but the days are identified by their commonly used name.

Posted by: uk_dave at November 29, 2005 01:08 PM

Spartacus,

I was just wondering how these folks determine that there are in fact no atheists in foxholes as they say.
In my military time I've held my best friends arm together with a bandana, had my own leg burned so bad the skin fell off like boiled chicken and walked around helping scared poopless folks put gas masks on during a chemical attack. (Turned out to be a false alarm thankfully). I never so much as uttered the name of any of the various gods that man has cooked up during any of those experiences. I also didn't bother to ask anybody else if they were praying or whatnot.

Just to show I'm a sport. Merry Christmas everybody. Happy Holidays to those that prefer....and If I could spell some of the other religious holidays I would wish the followers of those faiths some good cheer this season as well.
I am simply amazed that after all of these centuries we're still ready to kill whole groups of other people for religious convictions which NOBODY can prove to be true with anything other than their "Faith".

Posted by: James at November 29, 2005 01:11 PM

Hey, Mami... you still the same... :-)
------------------------------------------------

I know, I know (hee,hee)! We miss you, Papi, mi amor . .

Posted by: Liz PbD at November 29, 2005 01:13 PM

Bill, as a Christian myself I found all the posts you quoted to be funny. As they were meant to be. I'm offended by O'Reilly making Christmas all about profit.

Posted by: Alex Thorpe at November 29, 2005 01:15 PM

As a Canadian I can honestly say barely anybody knows anything about Boxing Day. It IS a holiday and held the day after Christmas.

All the vast majority of people know for sure, is that stores are open and have post Christmas clearance sales on almost ALL goods in stores. Therefore it is insane to do any shopping due to stores being busy and full of aggressive bargain hunters. It's a fight for survival more than shopping trip. Yet every year people rush out to stores. People will camp out in front of electronics stores over night to be the first to get in when they open the next day.

Posted by: Rosencrantz at November 29, 2005 01:16 PM

Also wanted to add the idea of a Christmas tree was also "stolen" from the pagans. Since the evergreen looked the same all year round, worshippers would offer gifts to it by hanging them on the branches, in hopes of pleasing the god(s) that kept it healthy and green. They believed this encouraged the gods to eventually end winter and change the weather to something nicer...and greener like the tree.

Posted by: Rosencrantz at November 29, 2005 01:18 PM

awwwww trust woodlands junior school to come up with the real info....

"Boxing Day is the following day after Christmas Day. Like Christmas Day it is also a national holiday in England. The name goes back to medieval times, more than 800 years ago, when alms boxes were placed at the back of every church to collect money for the poor. "

http://www.woodlands-junior.kent.sch.uk/customs/Xmas/boxingday.html

Let's hear it for the kids!

Posted by: uk_dave at November 29, 2005 01:18 PM

James wrote:
In my military time I've held my best friends arm together with a bandana, had my own leg burned so bad the skin fell off like boiled chicken and walked around helping scared poopless folks put gas masks on during a chemical attack.
--------------------------------------------------
OK (???????)

Posted by: Spartacus at November 29, 2005 01:20 PM

Hey, Mami... you still the same... :-)
------------------------------------------------

I know, I know (hee,hee)! We miss you, Papi, mi amor . .

Posted by: Liz PbD at November 29, 2005 01:13 PM
-------------------------------------------------

I miss you too, Mami. Hey, I just joined the Episcopal Church. I am too liberal to be Roman Catholic and may be sent by the bishop to NY or VA to study for the prietshood to be an episcopal priest. Hopefully, they will give me credit for my previous studies.

Posted by: Jorge at November 29, 2005 01:22 PM

adamannapolis wrote:
But surely there is humor (black humor) in the fact that 1 million people were killed in Sudan in a huge Genocide, which warranted little to no airtime on Fox....
----------------------------------------------------
Or any other network. I was in Sudan and am STILL in the middle of editing almost 20 hours of video footage of what took place there. Amazing how we only seem to care if the victims are white.

Posted by: Spartacus at November 29, 2005 01:24 PM

crikey.... it's an episcopal love in

is that legal?

Posted by: uk_dave at November 29, 2005 01:24 PM

Just to show I'm a sport. Merry Christmas everybody.

Posted by: James

Marie Therese,

Above is just one of the many examples of virulent pro-christian, pro-Christmas propaganda that have infiltrated this thread. I hope that you will delete all these offensive comments, as they are sincere expressions of the writer's opinions and beliefs and a threat to our diabolical left wing agenda of politically correct mind control.

You may also need to ban several people, as they continue to engage in an open and honest exchange of ideas inspite of the fact that not all of the posters agree with them. This may result in useful information being shared and mutual understanding acheived. Clearly, this can not be allowed to happen.

adamannapolis will not require any editing, as he has admitted that he is part of the sinister zionist conspiracy. His honesty was disarming, but then I remembered that he is not the same faith as me, so I went back to irrationally hating him and felt much better. He is probably still upset that Wal-mart has chosen to label their menorahs as "Holiday Menorahs" instead of using the proper term "Christmas Menorahs".

Have a cool Yule, don't be no fool.

Posted by: Joe at November 29, 2005 01:26 PM

a couple of comments here

1. who did jesus drive out of the temple....dissenters? or money lenders?

2. the other main group of people jesus railed against were the pharisees....those who (couldn't follow there own laws) but demanded others do so....ie hypocrites who decided they were saved but others were not....sound familiar? evangelicals!

3. if you cannot serve god AND $$$, why do the evangelicals all preach that if you follow their teachings, you will be blessed with earthly materialism?

didn't jesus say that if you wanted to follow him, to give all your possesions away to the poor?

how can that be reconciled with the current "hypocrites" who don't want to pay 50 billion a year of their tax money to help the poor (all social programs)

but have no problem spending 700 billion to kill innocents and muslims half way round the world...

turn the other cheek, indeed?

do good to them that abuse you...indeed?

Posted by: woke dude at November 29, 2005 01:27 PM

Blessed are the peacemakers, for they shall be called the children of God. JC

nuff said

Posted by: woke dude at November 29, 2005 01:33 PM

Stosh is right--like many right wing obsessions the "War on Christmas" is more about forms than substance and anyone who has a tizzy because someone says "Happy Holidays" to them probably has a spiritual deficit. This is more about enforcing Christmas not celebrating it.

Posted by: mcsweet at November 29, 2005 01:43 PM

Good post, Dude, interestingly . . .

Those RW Christian extremists, always talkin' about the bible but conveniently never quoting from it . .

Posted by: Liz PbD at November 29, 2005 01:45 PM

Joe -

LOL! You added mirth and merriment to my morning!

And a happy Chrismahanakwanzaa to you!

Marie Therese

Posted by: Marie Therese at November 29, 2005 01:49 PM

Papi, that's wonderful news! I hope they send you to New York, you'll love it here! A Priest, hmmmmmmm . . .

Posted by: Liz PbD at November 29, 2005 01:54 PM

Liz,

I'm convinced it's because they haven't been able to get beyond the "begats" and Leviticus....based on the "eye for an eye" bs they usually spew....

and tend to allow the "used car salesmen evangelical preachers" and politician who use religion to control the masses (think neo cons) to tell them what it says

instead of reading the words in red in the new testament...

pity

Posted by: woke dude at November 29, 2005 01:58 PM

Bill,
Many of us believe that organized religion is merely a crutch for the weak-minded, and look to the LONG, LONG, LONG history of abuses of humanity by the various Christian churches in formulating our opinions on these issues. Your individual Christianity doesn't bother me a bit, Bill, and I'm sorry if you find my satire offensive. I find everything I say much less offensive than Christian leaders calling for the execution of foreign heads of state (Chavez), Catholic priests sexually abusing innocent children, the televangelists who took thousands of dollars from my elderly grandmother leaving her destitute, the teachings of the PromiseKeepers, and armed conflict of any type or fashion in the name of a man whose very existence was supposed to spread only peace throughout all history. Now, the whoring out of Jesus' name and the Christian cause for political and commercial gain has been the final straw for me. I have great trouble seeing the beauty in the religion when the teachings have been thus perverted. If I poke fun at the "Miracles," I understand why you'd be offended, but it's still America and I still reserve my own right to believe the universe has and always will be subject to the laws of physics and science. If my words are in poor taste at times, well, let me just say that that's a relative term, and redirect you to the post by Joe at November 29, 2005 09:49 AM. He is more succinct and eloquent than myself, and doesn't seem to have the level of anger and mistrust that I do. To whomever said maybe the state religion shou

Salud!

Shane

Posted by: Shane at November 29, 2005 02:02 PM

To whomever said maybe the state religion should be capitalism, I applaus you. The only thing everyone seems to be into is making money!

Posted by: Shane (again) at November 29, 2005 02:03 PM

Bill O'Reilly is just plain full of shit. First of all with his "tiny" liberal list, MSNBC is a competitor, and anybody that watches them will see they are definitely right of center. As for the Christmas bullshit, come on, nobody is stealing or shutting Christmas. This has turned into Fox's yearly "crusade" to try to get any reasonable people that watch them to blame liberals for something else. I'm just to the right of a Socialist and I could give a fuck about Christmas, merry xmas, happy holidays, or what the fuck ever. I believe in the next few years we will all begin to see the fall of FNC, already they are getting really hard to take for some of their "watchers".

Marty

Posted by: Marty at November 29, 2005 02:04 PM

Papi, that's wonderful news! I hope they send you to New York, you'll love it here! A Priest, hmmmmmmm . . .

Posted by: Liz PbD at November 29, 2005 01:54 PM
-------------------------------------------------

Mami,

I know. I am excited too. Not your typical priest if you're familiar with the Episcopal Church... :-)

Posted by: Jorge at November 29, 2005 02:05 PM

Where have you gone, Thomas Jefferson?
Posted by: mondojohnson at November 29, 2005 12:55 PM
________________
A nation turns it lonely eyes to you...
Woo Woo Woo...

Posted by: ihaterwtrolls at November 29, 2005 02:09 PM

The secular Left wants to rid the West of Judeo-Christian values, which is why the Left doesn't condemn Radical Islam, because that would put the Left on the same side as those with Judeo-Christian values.

_
That’s just another weak and tired talking point (damn I hate that phrase) trotted out from the so called Christian majority spokespersons handbook. I will tell you this…I have no problem with any religion or faith per se and I will condemn any radical religious sect that twists the tenets of the original doctrine.
Why is it imperative for Christians to “wear” the faith on a big sign wrapped around the flag? Keep it private. Keep it personal. Almost every neighborhood in this country has places of worship. They are not under attack.
Seems like all RW fanatics can do is to declare a ‘war” on something and then create division. The same “Christians” who complain about the ACLU gladly accept their help when Big Brother comes a knockin’.
Christians are in the majority. Isn’t that enough? Or is a complete and total theocracy the goal?

BTW
http://www.salon.com/news/feature/2005/11/29/foxman/index_np.html

Posted by: ihaterwtrolls at November 29, 2005 02:12 PM

It is always funny to me how those that are doing the damage to the country, are always the first ones to say they are being attacked. O'Reilly told on himself as to what this is really about: profit. It is all about money to him. This holiday has nothing to do with business, but to someone as cold and unloving as O'Reilly, all he can see are the dollar signs.

Personally, as a Christian, I am not offended one way or another on this. If I say Merry Christmas to you and you do not celebrate Christmas...sorry. My mistake. I don't see why anyone would get offended by hearing Merry Christmas, just like nobody should be offended if they say Happy Holidays. If either one offends you, the problem is yours not mine. I will simply apologize and move on. If you anyone dwells on this at all, then they need help.

Bottom line is that me saying Merry Christmas is not me "witnessing" to you anymore then you saying Happy Holidays is attacking my beliefs.

Posted by: jay davis PsD at November 29, 2005 02:14 PM

Bottom line is that me saying Merry Christmas is not me "witnessing" to you anymore then you saying Happy Holidays is attacking my beliefs.
Posted by: jay davis PsD at November 29, 2005 02:14 PM
Damn, I should have waited two more minutes for your post…You said it better and more succinctly.

Posted by: ihaterwtrolls at November 29, 2005 02:17 PM

It's never as good as when we were kids. ... My tastes have changed since I wanted a BB gun as a boy.

Posted by: Spartacus at November 29, 2005 11:59 AM
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

You probably didn't get the BB gun, though, because Santa told you, "You'll shoot your eye out, kid."

(Thanks to "A Christmas Story")

MTL

Posted by: MikeTheLiberal at November 29, 2005 02:26 PM

but, apparently he didn't shoot his eye out since he did 3 tours in nam..eh?

heh,heh

hi MTL

and

semper fi to spartacus

Posted by: woke dude at November 29, 2005 02:29 PM

crikey.... it's an episcopal love in

is that legal?

Posted by: uk_dave at November 29, 2005 01:24 PM
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Absolutely! We don't follow Roman Catholic doctrine.

MTL
Episcopal, and loving it!

Posted by: MikeTheLiberal at November 29, 2005 02:30 PM

woke...'sup dude?

How's Ava Rose?

Posted by: ihaterwtrolls at November 29, 2005 02:30 PM

/waves to woke dude.

MTL

Posted by: MikeTheLiberal at November 29, 2005 02:31 PM

You probably didn't get the BB gun, though, because Santa told you, "You'll shoot your eye out, kid."

(Thanks to "A Christmas Story")

MTL
__
Mike, did you ever have the opportunity to listen to Jean Sheppard do his radio program? He's the guy who narrated that movie.

Posted by: ihaterwtrolls at November 29, 2005 02:32 PM

ihategopigs is undercover working for the vast left wing elitist media!

Posted by: ihaterwtrolls at November 29, 2005 02:34 PM

she's sleeping quietly right now, thanks for asking.....

Posted by: woke dude at November 29, 2005 02:39 PM

"O'Reilly made the following comment in his Talking Points Memo: "Every company in America should be on its knees thanking Jesus for being born. Without Christmas, most American businesses would be far less profitable."

------------------------------------------

So the truth comes out! O'Reilly isn't upset that anyone is taking the Christianity out of Christmas, he is concerned only about the economic impact of the holiday!

How any Christian can go along with this nonsense is baffling.

Posted by: Stosh at November 29, 2005 02:42 PM

"As we shall see, the concept of time has no meaning before the beginning of the universe. This was first pointed out by St. Augustine. When asked: What did God do before he created the universe? Augustine didn't reply: He was preparing Hell for people who asked such questions. Instead, he said that time was a property of the universe that God created, and that time did not exist before the beginning of the universe. (Stephen Hawking, A Brief History of Time)
Posted by: Robrob at November 29, 2005 12:38 PM

I’ve been teaching this for several years.

God exist outside of time and space or that is to say that time and space exit in God as a thought exit in your mind.

Thank you Robrob for your post.

Ervin

Posted by: Ervin at November 29, 2005 02:48 PM

ihaterwtrolls:

Oh dont worry...your post was great as well. People tend to forget that many of those who are for the Happy Holidays greeting are just as easily offended as those that want the classic Merry Christmas...really this is not an issue at all. If your main concern is what I am wishing you, then you are missing the entire point of the season. Whether you are religious or not, nobody can argue the fact that this holiday is about family. If you can not see that, then there is something wrong.

Posted by: jay davis PsD at November 29, 2005 02:50 PM

q]
The attacks on Christ, on this website, serve no interest but to hurt us and demean that which we hold sacred.
[/q]

What, some one put a gun to your head to force you to come here?

Jesus doesn't like whiners!

BTW: For all of you interested in discussing the broader aspects of Christianity and Atheism, there's two excellent threads over in Off Topic. They're either on the first or second page. I'd prolly be better to discuss those things there.

Posted by: Kim, Pb.D at November 29, 2005 01:01 PM

...Why wouldn't i come here. You have been nice enough to watch FOX for me. The people you offend today will be the same people you will be bitching about tomorrow because they didn't vote your way. You guys will never get it. All i ever seem to see here is how much hate you can build up and then call people names. That will never win over a single person. I'll leave for now... enjoy your wallowing in whatever sort of humor you all enjoy. When you find yourself in the minority at election time remeber those that you called whiners. Ya know, i read the whining in here for bout fifteen minutes and tried to really start a discussion to find out why you hate the christian religion and/ or christ. No luck. Good luck! Enjoy your peers.

Posted by: bill at November 29, 2005 02:57 PM

Bill,
You are part of what is wrong in this country. You are a one issue voter. Do you think all of the 70 plus percent you claim...are as stupid & biased as you are? By the way...I'm going to cancel out your vote

Happy Holidays..Pinhead

Posted by: kdog at November 29, 2005 03:02 PM

One more thing..Evangelicals are a cancer on our society

Posted by: kdog at November 29, 2005 03:03 PM

a know, i read the whining in here for bout fifteen minutes and tried to really start a discussion to find out why you hate the christian religion and/ or christ. No luck. Good luck! Enjoy your peers.

Posted by: bill at November 29, 2005 02:57 PM
_

See ya.
BTW, no one said they HATED the Christian faith or Christ. I sure didn't. I try not to use the word hate. But I am offended by the arrogance those in the majority seem to have.

Posted by: ihaterwtrolls at November 29, 2005 03:04 PM

bill:

I dont feel as though anyone in here hates Christ or the Christian religion. In fact, most of the attacks in here have come from so called "Christians"...some have went as far as saying that if they were Christ, they would strike us all down and sign their name to it.

Honestly, are you offended at someone saying Happy Holidays to you over Merry Christmas? I have asked this on both sides so far. If one greeting over the other offends you, then I would love to know why. They certainly dont offend me, and I am a proud, and devout Christian.

Posted by: jay davis PsD at November 29, 2005 03:07 PM

Who are the secular forces what country are they from can any one join. The name holliday season is used to desribe Thanksgiving Cristmas and New Years and you could include trick or treat day like sumer season winter season fall season spring season and then there is the season for hollidays do you think the Fox dummies could under stand this, no their to dumb.
O'Reily is not Riply bleave it or not O'Reily belongs to the pecular bunch what seculars call pricks they call lunch. PS the pecular bunch preach that the day they killed Christ is called good Friday. BULLSHIT

Posted by: Monte Schlarman at November 29, 2005 03:09 PM

I have never been able to understand why people get upset if their faith is attacked. Why does it matter what someone else thinks about your god or the myths which surround it?

Why does a book, a collection of wood pulp and ink, take on a seemingly mystical importance when it is produced as a bible, koran or any other religious text?

It's still only ink and paper.

If I tear up a koran and flush it down the toilet, go and buy another one. Likewise for the bible.

If I insult your god laugh in my face, because your faith tells you that you are right and I am wrong. Why get upset? move on.

Or is your faith so weak, so fragile that you are scared of an alternative belief, or no belief at all? Are you expecting your god to strike me down with a bolt of lightening, but when this doesn't happen, do you feel the need to become the lightening bolt yourself? (not you dreamryder, you're too dim).

oooooooo i can hear thunder outsi

Posted by: uk_dave at November 29, 2005 03:10 PM

"Celebrating "Cultural Diveristy" has gone way too far in this country."

-Posted by: Spartacus at November 29, 2005 10:49 AM

I guess that's what happens when you live in the most culturally diverse country that has ever existed.

Think. Then speak if necessary.

Posted by: Gooch_X at November 29, 2005 03:13 PM

He's lost it, he's really lost it!
Posted by: stew at November 29, 2005 08:36 AM
----------------------
I reached this same conclusion some time ago and, with that basic understanding, I can deal with his inconsistent, irrational, often incomprehensible babbling. His positions and statements never make sense, but how could I expect them to?

I rarely email him anymore because I honestly believe he has a mental problem and I don't think it is right to abuse people like that. I will admit that I do occasionally fail to live up to my principles and send him an email which always includes the fact that I no longer get my information about him from FOX but from the News Hounds. I'm pretty sure that his emails must be pre-screened, so I try to make my point in a way that gives his staff a bit of variety and humor.

Having said all of that, this has been one fun thread to read. I thank Bill for that (and all the commenters, of course).

Posted by: John L at November 29, 2005 03:24 PM

The interesting thing about O'Reilly's position is that he seems to imply that it may be a good thing for his listeners to not buy from stores that have their employes say "Happy Holidays.".....Whether he intends that to be the goal or not, it certainly seems some people have taken it that way, as they have vowed not to buy from those stores in the e-mail segment......Great, if we can knock down the business for those stores a bit, then they will have to cut back on the pay and hours of their employes through the Christmas season, thus causing hardships for them in terms of giving the most bountiful possible Christmas to their families. A lot of these employees are single moms with kids etc......How Christian of Bill O'Reilly.

Posted by: Wes at November 29, 2005 03:24 PM

Why does a book, a collection of wood pulp and ink, take on a seemingly mystical importance when it is produced as a bible, koran or any other religious text?

It's still only ink and paper.
__
Perfectly put.
It reminds me of a time when I was still working. A boss of mine gave me a religious tract. Of course Christ's picture was on the front. I looked at it and casually put in my desk drawer. Then every day or so when I would open the drawer, I’d see the tract. It was quite large, (the tract, not the drawer) and it was taking up room. I really wanted to toss it. But something in my head said “Don’t you dare”. Then one day my bible study teacher showed up. He happened to see the tract in my drawer whereupon I told him I wanted to throw it out but was reluctant. With a smirk on his face and a chuckle he said: Go ahead…it’s only a picture. If you believe, you believe.

The truth is the truth
It is what it is

Posted by: ihaterwtrolls at November 29, 2005 03:28 PM

[q]
Ya know, i read the whining in here for bout fifteen minutes and tried to really start a discussion to find out why you hate the christian religion and/ or christ.
[/q]

Bull. You didn't try to start a discussion, you just whined about how maligned and put upon you were.

For a majority of the population, you guys sure do complain a lot.

Posted by: Kim, Pb.D at November 29, 2005 03:28 PM

Can you picture them if they were a minority?

Posted by: Wes at November 29, 2005 03:29 PM

I rarely post the same thing in two threads, but as long as we're on "the war on Christmas", I thought I'd share this.

Personally, I'd like to see Alan get ready for one of these items this way:

SH: We're here with Chris Moralist, who will discuss the persecution of Christians. Today, we believers were outraged when Macy's had a Mennorah in its window. Chris ...

CM: Yes.

SH: ... that's short for Christian, right?

CM: Right.

SH: Okay, now my secular, liberal, panty-waist co-host will try to defend this outlandish event. Go get'em, Chris.

AC: Actually, I don't have any real questions for Chris, because there is no war on Christmas. That's about as inane as a war on the Fourth of July. In fact, Chris, my real question is this: if 85% of the people in America celebrate Christmas, how can you come on here, with mock indignation, and claim you are being persecuted?

SH and CM look on, slack-jawed.

MTL

Posted by: MikeTheLiberal at November 29, 2005 04:02 PM

"Every company in America should be on its knees thanking Jesus for being born."

The company I work for is owned by a Jew. I don't think that's going to happen.

Does Mr. O'Reilly realize that Jesus' mother was an unmarried teenage girl? Or that he was from a family of poor, undocumented immigrants?

Since when was MSNBC "far-left wing"?

Posted by: Sparky at November 29, 2005 04:07 PM

I have never been able to understand why people get upset if their faith is attacked. Why does it matter what someone else thinks about your god or the myths which surround it?
Why does a book, a collection of wood pulp and ink, take on a seemingly mystical importance when it is produced as a bible, koran or any other religious text?
It's still only ink and paper.
If I tear up a koran and flush it down the toilet, go and buy another one. Likewise for the bible.
If I insult your god laugh in my face, because your faith tells you that you are right and I am wrong. Why get upset? move on.
Or is your faith so weak, so fragile that you are scared of an alternative belief, or no belief at all? Are you expecting your god to strike me down with a bolt of lightening, but when this doesn't happen, do you feel the need to become the lightening bolt yourself? (not you dreamryder, you're too dim).
oooooooo i can hear thunder outsi
Posted by: uk_dave at November 29, 2005 03:10 PM
Uk dave,

I agree with you.

There are only two kinds of people walking on this earth the sons of men and the sons of God those who fear God and those who don’t.

People who need religion or better yet, a religious system is afraid of God or at least people who go to church any church I would agree the vast numbers of them are there because they are afraid of God.

God does not have a religion so why should I and even more why should I be afraid of your God or anyone else’s if I am in good standing with the true one then there is nothing to be afraid of.

A wizard is a preacher because just like preachers they use heresies to cast spells which capture the minds of people.

Heresies are stolen ideas ( such as the trinity ) which if you can persuade a small group of people such an idea is true you make them serve you but think what they are doing is serving God.

I essence bewitching their minds like the religious Jews did to the believers of Galatia in the book of Galatians.

Of course in the mind of your average Christian especially conservative Christians how much thought do you think they give to the possibility that what they think God is could perhaps be wrong.

Religion is the invention of the devil because the messengers of Satan are transformed into the angels of God.

You cannot be a holy man if you are polluted by some religious idea. If you are defiled by religious ideas such as life after death you cannot hear the voice of the true and living God.

It is the same as if you were a drug addict the drug has the power over your body the wizards spell or the dogma has the power over your mind.

What most Christians don’t get is that the devil stole or should I say Adam gave the powers that God gave him, which made dominion possible, to the devil and the devil gives those powers to whoever he chooses because they are his to give.

A great example of what I would call a sorcerer turned apostle and using heresies as spells on the minds of unsuspecting people is Rush Limbaugh.

He has what he calls the undeniable truths one of them is that the world is used by the aggressive use of force this idea is a heresy because mankind cannot rule the world he is subject to the power of death therefore the world rules man.

Wizards appear to be almost in complete control of the earth now so it can’t possibly be much longer until the great revelation promised by God.

If you think about it the people in power are the living incarnation of the saying by Jesus the blind lead the blind.

The republicans do not have blind faith they are blinded by faith they are as bewitched as the people of Samaria were by Simon the sorcerer.

Posted by: Ervin at November 29, 2005 04:12 PM

Spartacus

First you cant paint Conservatives with 2 brushes... some of are fisical Conservatives, but liberal when it comes to our private lives which then also supports a smaller government and less regulations. In that there is not the conflict we now have in the republican party. The two do not go together!

Secondly I dont like religious fundalmentalism no matter the name of the religion whether it be Christain or Islam... which are based on the same god and the old testatment which many appear not to know. And it was Bush who for years refered to this as a war on terror (which is a miliarty tactic, not a specifc enemy you can fight) and not who attakced us, which was radical islamic fundalmentalist.. just like the Iranian government he has now installed in IRAQ.

The last time we had a rise in Christian Fundalmentalism, there was also a lot of terrorism. The Spanish Inquistion with torture and burning heritics at the stake and 1000 years of no progress called the dark ages and wars between Christain sects and against Islam. Seems we have not learned much.

Pls note it was radical Christian Fundalmentalist who blew up medical clinics and bombed the Atlanta Olympics.

And yes everyone probably believes in a Creator, such as Thomas Jefferson and George Washington did (they were not Christians but Deist), but not a God based on what a particular religion has prescribed certain deeds/actions and values too.

Thats why GOD is not referenced in our founding documents, only the word Creator.

Its the Christian faith that says the universe was created in just six days which is all of a sudden compared to 14 billion years. If we were only 6,000 years old there is light from many stars you could not even see yet that do shine in our skies.

There are now an estimated one billion galaxes each with about a billion stars and solar system/moons and etc. Thats alot of probablity to come up just with us over a lot of time and not a very intelligent design to create all that so one planet is the center of the universe( its not), and so some one can say we were created in Gods image (God needs an asshole?). Boy if thats not a large dose of vanity of course we also created Yogi Bear in our image and its more likley we created our vision of GOD in our image rather than the other way around. Just as the viking, Greeks and etc. did. Takes less imagination and easier to relate to, just like the paintings of Jesus have gone from jewish looking, to Roman looking and now to a tall slender figure, with blue eyes and long straight hair... the Anglo Saxon version.

Our body is a product of a lot of things including 1G gravity. Take away gravity and we would look more like jelly fish! Creating a billion galaxies just for us is certainly not effcient, nor intelligent. Do you really think God would need hands or reproductive organs if he is not around creating other Gods? Would he need a rib cage whose size reflects the lung capacity needed to breath in a certain amount of oxygen in our environment?

Since we exist, our probabilty is ONE. A universe exist because of a certain set of physical laws and energy in the case of this Universe. How do you know that there are not multible Universes with different sets of physical laws or that there have not been previous Universes. Entire galaxies are colliding and stars are still being born while others die as ours will in a couple of billion years.

Your answer is the Christain God created this Universe, Fine, but then who created GOD. All versions of creation including secular still come to a dead end we cant explain. What man does not know an answer to he invents an answer to. Some time the answer is correct and some times its not. Some people need an answer, the comfort thereof and others can accept not knowing all the answers so they can find more answers based on fact as opposed to what was written by those with the limited knowledge of 3000 years ago! We are still primative, just not that primative.

Do you really believe that wearing a blended suit of cotton and wool is a sin while eating some fine Pork ribs while filling out your U.S. census report. All of those are sins per the Bible. 70,000 People died at the hands of a plaque sent by your God because David had a census per the Old Testament. Do you really beieve that New Orleans was hit by a Hurricane because of women at Mardi Gras flashing their Breast for plastic beads?

Believe what you believe. Of course that can only happens if we maintain a separation of church and state. But pls dont force others to share those same beliefs and make those beliefs
law.

I think all of this crap about Christmas trees is ridiculous. Call them what you want, but on the other hand the store owner should have the same right. Of course the religious right is trying to shut down Halloween(and harry potter) because it will turn kids into practicing witches. FOX will not complain about that! All of the parties at this dance can look a wee bit foolish at times. But then thats been the role of religion through the ages. Another reason not to love your fellow man more often than not!

Celebrate Christmas, Easter just as the Greeks did. Who cares! Its a personal matter, its a personal belief or should be! But some people beliefs are so weak that they have together in large numbers to have the courage of their beliefs.

Merry Christmas...

and best regards

Posted by: Viper at November 29, 2005 04:14 PM

The melding of religious and corporate indoctrination is truly a sad and disturbing site to behold yet all too familiar. The two doctrines are always open to whimsical interpretation are bad enough by themselves.

Posted by: Nihilistic at November 29, 2005 04:20 PM

On the whole "we have to defend our faith" deal:

Years ago there was a fairly benign christian radio station in our area with a call-in program. One night I happened to be listening when a woman called in.

She explained to the host the she was a christian, that she had recently become much more active in her faith and that she was eager to spread the word of god. However, her husband, although a practicing christian, was not as active as she and did not feel the compelling spiritual call that she did. She asked what she could do to make her husband feel the way she did.

The host replied that there was nothing she could do, that it was not her choice how another person should feel toward god and she would have to learn to accept that. "Jesus", he gently explained to her, "wants volunteers, not conscripts."

I wish more of the religious conservatives we deal with today had that man's wisdom.

Posted by: Joe at November 29, 2005 04:31 PM

Why yes, I did send my son to earth so businesses in the 21st century can be more profitable. I am God and I can forsee into the future and I saw businesses in the 21st century being 5% less profitable. So that is why I sent down my son. Too bad he didnt know it at the time, I have seemed to have forgotten. Sorry son.

Posted by: God at November 29, 2005 04:38 PM

good god, it's god!!

First edfromned comes back, now god himself.... is this the rapture i have been reading about... or maybe rupture!

Posted by: uk_dave at November 29, 2005 04:42 PM

http://funwithbillo.blogspot.com/

Posted by: blogme at November 29, 2005 04:44 PM

OT but a great read!!!!!

BY JOE LIEBERMAN

Tuesday, November 29, 2005 12:01 a.m. EST

I have just returned from my fourth trip to Iraq in the past 17 months and can report real progress there. More work needs to be done, of course, but the Iraqi people are in reach of a watershed transformation from the primitive, killing tyranny of Saddam to modern, self-governing, self-securing nationhood--unless the great American military that has given them and us this unexpected opportunity is prematurely withdrawn.

Progress is visible and practical. In the Kurdish North, there is continuing security and growing prosperity. The primarily Shiite South remains largely free of terrorism, receives much more electric power and other public services than it did under Saddam, and is experiencing greater economic activity. The Sunni triangle, geographically defined by Baghdad to the east, Tikrit to the north and Ramadi to the west, is where most of the terrorist enemy attacks occur. And yet here, too, there is progress.

There are many more cars on the streets, satellite television dishes on the roofs, and literally millions more cell phones in Iraqi hands than before. All of that says the Iraqi economy is growing. And Sunni candidates are actively campaigning for seats in the National Assembly. People are working their way toward a functioning society and economy in the midst of a very brutal, inhumane, sustained terrorist war against the civilian population and the Iraqi and American military there to protect it.

It is a war between 27 million and 10,000; 27 million Iraqis who want to live lives of freedom, opportunity and prosperity and roughly 10,000 terrorists who are either Saddam revanchists, Iraqi Islamic extremists or al Qaeda foreign fighters who know their wretched causes will be set back if Iraq becomes free and modern. The terrorists are intent on stopping this by instigating a civil war to produce the chaos that will allow Iraq to replace Afghanistan as the base for their fanatical war-making. We are fighting on the side of the 27 million because the outcome of this war is critically important to the security and freedom of America. If the terrorists win, they will be emboldened to strike us directly again and to further undermine the growing stability and progress in the Middle East, which has long been a major American national and economic security priority.

Before going to Iraq last week, I visited Israel and the Palestinian Authority. Israel has been the only genuine democracy in the region, but it is now getting some welcome company from the Iraqis and Palestinians who are in the midst of robust national legislative election campaigns, the Lebanese who have risen up in proud self-determination after the Hariri assassination to eject their Syrian occupiers (the Syrian- and Iranian-backed Hezbollah militias should be next), and the Kuwaitis, Egyptians and Saudis who have taken steps to open up their governments more broadly to their people. In my meeting with the thoughtful prime minister of Iraq, Ibrahim al-Jaafari, he declared with justifiable pride that his country now has the most open, democratic political system in the Arab world. He is right.

In the face of terrorist threats and escalating violence, eight million Iraqis voted for their interim national government in January, almost 10 million participated in the referendum on their new constitution in October, and even more than that are expected to vote in the elections for a full-term government on Dec. 15. Every time the 27 million Iraqis have been given the chance since Saddam was overthrown, they have voted for self-government and hope over the violence and hatred the 10,000 terrorists offer them. Most encouraging has been the behavior of the Sunni community, which, when disappointed by the proposed constitution, registered to vote and went to the polls instead of taking up arms and going to the streets. Last week, I was thrilled to see a vigorous political campaign, and a large number of independent television stations and newspapers covering it.

None of these remarkable changes would have happened without the coalition forces led by the U.S. And, I am convinced, almost all of the progress in Iraq and throughout the Middle East will be lost if those forces are withdrawn faster than the Iraqi military is capable of securing the country.

The leaders of Iraq's duly elected government understand this, and they asked me for reassurance about America's commitment. The question is whether the American people and enough of their representatives in Congress from both parties understand this. I am disappointed by Democrats who are more focused on how President Bush took America into the war in Iraq almost three years ago, and by Republicans who are more worried about whether the war will bring them down in next November's elections, than they are concerned about how we continue the progress in Iraq in the months and years ahead.

Here is an ironic finding I brought back from Iraq. While U.S. public opinion polls show serious declines in support for the war and increasing pessimism about how it will end, polls conducted by Iraqis for Iraqi universities show increasing optimism. Two-thirds say they are better off than they were under Saddam, and a resounding 82% are confident their lives in Iraq will be better a year from now than they are today. What a colossal mistake it would be for America's bipartisan political leadership to choose this moment in history to lose its will and, in the famous phrase, to seize defeat from the jaws of the coming victory.

The leaders of America's military and diplomatic forces in Iraq, Gen. George Casey and Ambassador Zal Khalilzad, have a clear and compelling vision of our mission there. It is to create the environment in which Iraqi democracy, security and prosperity can take hold and the Iraqis themselves can defend their political progress against those 10,000 terrorists who would take it from them.

Does America have a good plan for doing this, a strategy for victory in Iraq? Yes we do. And it is important to make it clear to the American people that the plan has not remained stubbornly still but has changed over the years. Mistakes, some of them big, were made after Saddam was removed, and no one who supports the war should hesitate to admit that; but we have learned from those mistakes and, in characteristic American fashion, from what has worked and not worked on the ground. The administration's recent use of the banner "clear, hold and build" accurately describes the strategy as I saw it being implemented last week.

We are now embedding a core of coalition forces in every Iraqi fighting unit, which makes each unit more effective and acts as a multiplier of our forces. Progress in "clearing" and "holding" is being made. The Sixth Infantry Division of the Iraqi Security Forces now controls and polices more than one-third of Baghdad on its own. Coalition and Iraqi forces have together cleared the previously terrorist-controlled cities of Fallujah, Mosul and Tal Afar, and most of the border with Syria. Those areas are now being "held" secure by the Iraqi military themselves. Iraqi and coalition forces are jointly carrying out a mission to clear Ramadi, now the most dangerous city in Al-Anbar province at the west end of the Sunni Triangle.

Nationwide, American military leaders estimate that about one-third of the approximately 100,000 members of the Iraqi military are able to "lead the fight" themselves with logistical support from the U.S., and that that number should double by next year. If that happens, American military forces could begin a drawdown in numbers proportional to the increasing self-sufficiency of the Iraqi forces in 2006. If all goes well, I believe we can have a much smaller American military presence there by the end of 2006 or in 2007, but it is also likely that our presence will need to be significant in Iraq or nearby for years to come.

The economic reconstruction of Iraq has gone slower than it should have, and too much money has been wasted or stolen. Ambassador Khalilzad is now implementing reform that has worked in Afghanistan--Provincial Reconstruction Teams, composed of American economic and political experts, working in partnership in each of Iraq's 18 provinces with its elected leadership, civil service and the private sector. That is the "build" part of the "clear, hold and build" strategy, and so is the work American and international teams are doing to professionalize national and provincial governmental agencies in Iraq.

These are new ideas that are working and changing the reality on the ground, which is undoubtedly why the Iraqi people are optimistic about their future--and why the American people should be, too.

I cannot say enough about the U.S. Army and Marines who are carrying most of the fight for us in Iraq. They are courageous, smart, effective, innovative, very honorable and very proud. After a Thanksgiving meal with a great group of Marines at Camp Fallujah in western Iraq, I asked their commander whether the morale of his troops had been hurt by the growing public dissent in America over the war in Iraq. His answer was insightful, instructive and inspirational: "I would guess that if the opposition and division at home go on a lot longer and get a lot deeper it might have some effect, but, Senator, my Marines are motivated by their devotion to each other and the cause, not by political debates."

Thank you, General. That is a powerful, needed message for the rest of America and its political leadership at this critical moment in our nation's history. Semper Fi.

Mr. Lieberman is a Democratic senator from Connecticut.

Posted by: Tim3 at November 29, 2005 04:44 PM

tim3 you are so going to piss off the newshounds posting that in full all over this site

just do a quote and a link

Posted by: uk_dave at November 29, 2005 04:46 PM

Yeah, next time link it. I'm dizzy. It's a nice speech but it's as boring as he is.
zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

Posted by: ihaterwtrolls at November 29, 2005 04:54 PM

Viper, great post at November 29, 2005 04:14 PM

Posted by: ihaterwtrolls at November 29, 2005 04:55 PM

I have never read the Koran and have only read the Bible once but I think if we just throw them both out and realize and accept what great works of fictions they are and just do one thing, we would be a better species for it.

Take the 10 Commandments (there use to 15 but Mel Brooks screwed that up) and teach your children those. If they are really the basis of all of our laws, what else does the Bible offer except points of arguments?

It's been suggested and I believe, the Bible at the time it was written, was what television is to us today. Mao said that religion was the opiate of the masses. Bill Watterson stated that with television, you haven't seen anything yet.

The Bible has had how many revisions? How the hell does one gather enough unmitigated gull to change the words of God? I want that person on my team. Talk about confidence.

Bush talked to God? Whoa. Now that's scary. If I had said that, in public no less, I'd be visiting the local mental health department, and not on my own initiative.

If the Raptures is true then how in the wide world of sports is the meek going to be around inherit the earth? The way Bush is going who might want what’s left?

I really respect people of faith. If it's what get you through the night, more power to ya. Just do me a favor. Keep it to yourself. Most real Christians do.

Posted by: edfromned at November 29, 2005 05:00 PM

Does Mr. O'Reilly realize that Jesus' mother was an unmarried teenage girl? Or that he was from a family of poor, undocumented immigrants?
----------------------
Good thing Christ was born 2000 years ago. Today the Democrats would encourge Mary to get an abortion -- and then make the taxpayers pay for it.

Posted by: Flatlander at November 29, 2005 05:04 PM

Nice one, edfromned. The break did you good!
I was thinking of taking a break myself, but someone has to be around here in the UK morning to make sure office ed is getting his work done.

The bible, or any religious text is only ever going to be mans interpretation of what he thinks his god wants.

I always feel that the religious show (at times) a remarkable degree of self righteousness when they claim the ten commandments as some kind of unique set of laws/rules, without which we would all be killing and stealing and coveting asses. These rules are merely distillation of societal rules which evolve (had to get that one in) as societies evolve; they are just common sense laws which allow any society, primitive or advanced, to function.

And, of course, if any of the faithful here really believe that without those commandments they would indeed go on a murderous rampage, well.... there are medications you can try.... or move to idaho.

Posted by: uk_dave at November 29, 2005 05:10 PM

Did Jesus not expel or try to expel the money people from the temple ( a place of prayer).
So o'Reilly wants people to pray to Jesus / thank Jesus in commercial establishments ( because those establishments are making money).
you can also send what you do not spend to the tv preachers who thank Jesus all the time.

Posted by: sam at November 29, 2005 05:15 PM

uk_dave I saw you post over on the other one. Thanks. Now what the hell is a whip round? Like passing the hat?

The more important question is how do you know about the wacko's in Idaho? Is there this deep secret your keeping from us? Do I need to start sleeping with a gun?

again thanks

Posted by: edfromned at November 29, 2005 05:15 PM

Good thing Christ was born 2000 years ago. Today the Democrats would encourge Mary to get an abortion -- and then make the taxpayers pay for it.

Posted by: Flatlander at November 29, 2005 05:04 PM

'encourage', not 'force'? or is that just the republican way?
of course the republicans would no doubt force mary to work in wal-mart and put her on medicaid.

as for jesus.... well, the long hair, peace and love attitude, together with lack of girlfriend.... you sure the republicans want him on their platform?

Posted by: uk_dave at November 29, 2005 05:18 PM

lol edfromned... yep whip round is passing the hat.

as for idaho... well i do know about ruby ridge! lol

and you can sleep with anything or anyone you want!

Posted by: uk_dave at November 29, 2005 05:21 PM

Good thing Christ was born 2000 years ago. Today the Democrats would encourge Mary to get an abortion -- and then make the taxpayers pay for it.

Posted by: Flatlander at November 29, 2005 05:04 PM

The republicans would force Mary to have the baby so they could raise it in the minion army of the New World Order at tax payer expense of course.

Then once the have raised a large enough army of stolen babes they would force them to invade the counties that they came from and kill their own blood relatives to keep them from finding out who’s in their real family tree to make certain that they never doubt any of the lies they were told as children.

Posted by: Ervin at November 29, 2005 05:22 PM